Cory Cameron Letter to the Editor – Going Postal……the Canadian Way!

LTEWe’ve all wanted to go postal (all pun intended) at some time or another.  The type of day where you regret even leaving your front door to face the day.  The sort of day where you know that whatever you do, you just cannot make any headway nor win your cause in the least bit.   We’ve all had those kinds of days whereby, ’ The Shirelles’ invented the song, “Mama Said” to describe them.

 

And so it was a normal, cool, crisp and sunny Northern Ontario morning last April whenever I left the house to mail a letter at the Post Office.  I had not much to do that day; and figured I would take complete advantage of the time I had to run a few errands.  My first step was the Post Office.

 

There was no lineup when I arrived and felt blessed that my luck was so far, so good.  I was wrong though.  As I approached the mid-age woman working behind the desk I greeted her and wished her a good morning and requested to purchase a stamp in the language of my choice, which happens to be English.  She obliged by producing the stamp and not returning the greeting in English nor French.  The remainder of our exchange during the few minutes had me requesting my service in English whereby her portion of the exchange was conducted in French.

 

Now, normally this situation wouldn’t be a problem for me as everyone knows I’m bilingual.  But on this particular day, I couldn’t get over the fact that I showed absolutely no inclination at all as to being bilingual.  Why wasn’t I served in English when clearly I greeted the worker in English upon the beginning of our exchange?  Further, why didn’t the Postal Worker switch to English whenever I was communicating in said language?  I could have switched to French but I decided not to.  My idea in this decision had to do with the fact that I felt that the worker was obligated to provide me with the service in English simply because I was the customer.  This would have been different if at any time she had informed me that she couldn’t speak English and would try to accommodate me by other means.  One such solution she could have sought out would be to perhaps seek out the services of another Postal Worker to serve me if she didn’t speak English herself.

 

In any case, I didn’t complain.  That is, I didn’t file a complaint at the Post Office.  As an aside, I have come across instances like this a few dozen times during the course of business transactions with civil service workers throughout the years and even some in the private industry.  And, after all was said and done, I never complained.  I had simply grown accustomed to situations like the one above and there is an argument to be made that I had become somewhat conditioned by these scenarios over the years.

 

Until now…

 

Perhaps it’s my newfound sense of fairness and pride that has awakened within me during these past two years.  Perhaps now that I’m a little longer in the tooth, I have decided that I no longer will take things lying down as it were.

 

I’m tired…

 

It’s one thing to learn a minority language and to enjoy the privileges of being able to read, write and speak in French.  But for what purpose and intent?  And to who’s benefit is it that I am bilingual?  Myself or to those whom I communicate with who have French as a first language?  I can honestly state that being bilingual hasn’t furthered my career options nor has it had the desired effect of garnishing career advancement opportunities for me in the job that I do have.  Moreover, I get the feeling that being bilingual for many of us Anglophones simply equates to making it easier for the Francophones to not have to learn English in order to communicate with us – such as in daily merchant transactions.

 

Enough…

 

It was with all of these thoughts swirling within my consciousness that April day that I made the conscientious decision to file a complaint with Canada’s, ‘Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages’.  Before doing so, however, I ensured that I had a valid complaint to begin with and checked out the ‘Filing a Complaint’ section, sub-section, ‘In what situations can I file a complaint’.  After reviewing the information, I determined that I did in fact have a valid complaint and filed an online complaint the day of my Post Office visit and an initial response was forthcoming from a representative within a week of filing the complaint.

 

The representative advised me that in order to solve the dilemma of what had occurred an investigation would take place as to the incident itself. Having said that, keep in mind that my complaint was well documented and filed only after a few hours of the incident taking place.  Everything that happened was written succinctly on the initial report!

So, after e-mail and playing telephone tag to which more than a half dozen e-mails and a half dozen telephone calls were sent between myself and the representative detailing what had occurred; I emphasized and re-emphasized that I wanted only one question answered – and that was the following:

 

Why, was I spoken to in French whenever I clearly communicated in English?

 

All of this to say that as month 3 was coming around the corner subsequent to the initial incident; I was informed that the investigation was completed and that the results would soon be forthcoming.  I have a few questions as to this entire affair after having gone through this experience.  One being why haven’t I been provided with a response yet after 3 months?  Certainly this is a cut and paste situation?

 

Why?

 

Exactly what justifies the creation of an, “Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages” to begin with.  As of 2011, there were 518 complaints that the office dealt with having to do with language issues.   On October 16, 2012 a Globe and Mail article reported that,

“Almost half of the 518 complaints came from the area around Ottawa and adjacent Gatineau, Que., …” (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/budget-cuts-are-hurting-bilingualism-official-languages-watchdog-warns/article4616263/).

 

Are Canadian taxpayers being led to believe that 518 language-related complaints warrant a full-time staff being paid civil service wages to investigate this?  I cannot help but comment that more work is done during an 8 hour shift by a half dozen or less call centre employees who themselves individually handle on average a little more than 100 calls a day.  It seems as though by comparing stats, we’re not exactly getting a great bang for our buck.  So, I would argue that what we have here is but another example of government incompetence; a type and kind of federal government language police make-work project that our taxes are paying for.

 

And I’ll say this much.  We already have a set of language police in this country.  We don’t require the services of another; let alone the foundational Office quebecois de la langue francaise.

 

Ask yourselves this much:  Will it take over 3 months to solve your next computer or cell phone issue by someone making minimum wage?  Probably not.  So why would something so trivial take so long to conclude by someone being paid so much?

(Comments and opinions of Editorials, Letters to the Editor, and comments from readers are purely their own and don’t necessarily reflect those of the owners of this site, their staff, or sponsors.)

 

James Moak

754 Comments

  1. silentfrancoamerican……thank-you for clarifying that.

    These English radicals are trying desperately to have people believe that in Quebec, they are fighting, almost to the point of killing each other because of the French **smile**

    I have unilingual English friends who live in Ville Lasalle, they all have good jobs and are never shunned for speaking only English.

  2. HAHAHAAHAHAHAH

    Yeah, and some of my best friends are unilingual french living in Ontario, yadda yadda yadda. What is your point? That you and your friends are better than everyone else?

  3. Thanks Eric for the information you sent me…….

    I was able this morning to discover the following through some research:

    Taken from: http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/pol/doc-eng.aspx?id=12515&section=text#cha3

    “Rescinded [2012-11-19] – Official Languages Policy Framework

    Institutional bilingualism:

    Institutional bilingualism is the capacity of the government and its institutions to communicate with the public, and within these institutions, in the two official languages. Individual bilingualism refers to a person’s ability to communicate in the two official languages. Institutional bilingualism does not automatically presuppose individual bilingualism.
    According to the Canadian model, the responsibility assumed by the federal government to communicate with its citizens is coupled with a commitment to serve its citizens in their own official language. Having adopted French and English as official languages, the government recognizes that it must adjust linguistically to the needs of the public. In doing so, the government confirms that it is not up to the citizens to adjust linguistically to the workings of government. It is the institution that becomes bilingual, not the public. However, to become operationally capable of serving people in the official language of their choice, the government must acquire the necessary linguistic resources, including a certain number of individually bilingual employees, without requiring all of its employees to be bilingual.”

    As Canada Post is a federal institution I believe this would be considered valid under my situation.

    What caught my eye was, ” In doing so, the government confirms that it is not up to the citizens to adjust linguistically to the workings of government.”

    Also, I checked out the link: http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/pubs_pol/hrpubs/offlang/chap5_101-eng.asp#northern which gives designated bilingual regions of Northern Ontario with Timmins listed under subsection 35(2)F.2.aTowns Timmins.

    So it seems that I do in fact have a case. And still waiting for the case worker’s conclusions and to contact me.

    Cory

  4. Mr Cameron, Did you think of asking her why she replied to you in French? Being functionally bilingual, in your shoes I would have relished the opportunity to ask pleasantly “Pourquoi vous me répondez en français?” hoping that would lead to a pleasant time-of-day exchange perhaps switching between languages.

    Was the postal worker actually rude in tone and manner? Was she perhaps having a rough day (family tragedy, devastating news) and therefore resorted to her first language for comfort in dealing with the public that day? What was your manner towards her?

    There’s more to personal interaction than the words we speak and the language we choose to speak them.

    Did this episode really need to go all the way to the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages with all the time and heat spent on it since—especially as you say you yourself are bilingual? Surely life’s too short!

  5. @ P.J.

    the francophone who ordered a drink on an air Canada flight, did that have to go all the way up the ladder as well?

    Maybe the flight attendant had a bad day etc.etc etc.

    Whats good for goose ,P.J. right?? Or No

    Please, they ( francophones) know they can get away with anything, but when the shoe is on the foot, this federal government CHOOSES NOT TO PROTECT MAJORITY RIGHTS IN THIS COUNTRY.

    I’ll give quebec this at least they make no bones about screwing the English, they do it openly and proudly, and we ,like sheep accept this garbage, while the feds duck, bob and weave, so as not to deal with legitimate English complaints.

  6. PJ…..exactly my point also. Radicals will go to extremes to prove their point.

    Any normal person would have walked away and never gave it a second thought. What is even more of a disgrace, is claiming that you are bilingual (cough cough) then having the audacity to report it and claim mistreatment by the postal worker. If that doesn’t look like a set up, then what is it? This scenario is worse then the smoke police sending minors into stores to buy smokes then nail the store owner.

    Like I said many times before, when one is looking for trouble, they usually find it.

  7. @PJ Robertson RE: your message on July 5, 2013 at 10:31 am

    I have to say… My personal experience in life has been such that i have learned first hand that sometimes words and actions — ARE literally — just as (if not more) brutally hurtful (and can some times feel just as physically painful) as a direct punch or slap in the face can feel.

    Having said this, even — IF — I TRY real hard to be fair and take into account your suggestion of the possibility that,

    “she was perhaps having a rough day (family tragedy, devastating news) and therefore resorted to her first language for comfort in dealing with the public that day?”

    and your further interesting suggestion that “the potential for learning that this situation could have presented.”

    I am still finding it VERY TOUGH NOT to see her actions as being anything but

    completely “rude in tone and manner”

    I suggest that if there was indeed some family tragedy involved on her part the signs would have no doubt been much more evident and i am sure Chris would have picked up on that. So, i MUST rule this out.

    What we are left with, is YOU SUGGESTING —

    Cory (the customer) who walked into a postal outlet in an English dominant town, in an English dominated country and in his words,

    “approached the mid-age woman working behind the desk I greeted her and wished her a good morning”

    and her (as front line service personnel) response while completely ignoring his respectful greeting was to go on to handling this whole transaction in French despite Cory continuing to respond in English, once again, despite the fact that the common / dominant language of the physical place where she is working (both the town & the country) is ENGLISH.

    — THAT Cory be the one to accept this metaphorical slap in the face and be able to set aside his hurt feelings and the “sting of the slap” in order to calmly ask (in the language of the person who slapped him in the face no less) why she was doing this ?

    Then suggesting it was not worthy of this “episode to go all the way to the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages”

    Considering that Cory, and I must add many of us, have the resentful filled feelings of how our fellow Canadians are being treated in other parts of THIS COUNTRY, OUR COUNTRY — namely the province Quebec — where the English language is (and has been for years now) being treated like dirt and where people tax payers and (customers no less) at transit systems and so on are routinely spit at, punched, and told DIRECTLY to their FACE IN PLAIN ENGLISH “WE DO NOT SERVE ENGLISH PEOPLE HERE”

    It certain DOES need to
    “go all the way to the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages”

    AND then SOME …
    This whole language thing absolutely MUST BE dealt with on a higher level …
    And if your government does not do anything then the people MUST stand up against this insanity.

    The human rights of the English people in the province of Quebec DO NOT deserve to have been forgotten by their own government and though i KNOW these situations are separate there is A COMMON thread.

    Tax paying citizens in Canada like Cory — SHOULD NOT — have to feel that disrespectful slap in the face in his own area / country in THAT WAY.

    NOTE A) I “somewhat” agree that the idea this could have lead “to a pleasant time-of-day exchange perhaps switching between languages” and how this — “MAY” have been — a great learning situation BUT, this unrealistic outcome would entail Cory being able to set aside being slapped in the face, and i challenge you or anyone to re-act in such a perfect way having had that kind of emotionally charged situation happen to you or them. PLUS, despite how positive “it could have been” it really wasn’t up to Cory as the customer to even begin to try to or want to do something like this.

    NOTE B) No matter what the circumstances, having Cory tell you how this person COMPLETELY ignored his good morning greeting and then disrespect his choice of language so blatantly in the manner Cory described the idea of you asking, “was the postal worker actually rude in tone and manner?” is not respectful to Cory.

  8. A set up stellabystarlight, is having a Canada Post employee going around to postal outlets and asking for one or two stamps in French, ignoring any English being spoken, then reporting back to head office. This goes on right here in Eastern Ontario.

    Ottawa outskirts postal stations are seeing the level of “needed” interaction increasing, not because of actual need, but to get more “bilingual” positions in place.

    So in your words, “Radicals will go to extremes to prove their point” and in this case, radicals are Canada Post language policies.

  9. Good afternoon, Mr. Robertson,

    You penned,

    “Mr Cameron, Did you think of asking her why she replied to you in French? Being functionally bilingual, in your shoes I would have relished the opportunity to ask pleasantly “Pourquoi vous me répondez en français?” hoping that would lead to a pleasant time-of-day exchange perhaps switching between languages.”

    I did think of doing this actually, yes. However, I have done this before in similar circumstances and have asked this very question. My responses were always fashioned in negative connotations and led me to believe that I was wasting the individual’s time by doing so. I have received everything from snickers to very negative body language whereby I’ve witnessed people’s faces turning red to actually having people walk away, ignore or sometimes display outright abusive behaviour. What sort of abusive behaviour? The kind that had receptionists in government and non-government offices take my resume forcefully as if I was a nuisance.

    “Was the postal worker actually rude in tone and manner?

    No, she wasn’t. Except the fact that she appeared mildly annoyed for having to serve me at all. It looked as though her heart wasn’t into it.

    “Was she perhaps having a rough day (family tragedy, devastating news) and therefore resorted to her first language for comfort in dealing with the public that day?”

    That’s a possibility. Though I didn’t want to stick around and find out. I didn’t feel welcome at all and didn’t exactly wish to prolong my morning experience with this woman by getting into personal details that were none of my business. It was very much a gesellschaft-type social interaction.

    “What was your manner towards her?”

    Business-like. I approached her with a nod, smile and good morning all at once.

    “There’s more to personal interaction than the words we speak and the language we choose to speak them.”

    I guess body language would come into play as well.

    “Did this episode really need to go all the way to the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages with all the time and heat spent on it since—especially as you say you yourself are bilingual? Surely life’s too short!”

    After experiencing this sort of thing at least a couple of dozen times with different people I no longer can ignore the stark realities. I did nothing to solicit/elicit the negative responses from the people that I’ve had these interactions with. In those cases whereby they were negative, I always felt uncomfortable like I was a hindrance with them or somehow a barrier to them. In those negative interactions, I always was left feeling guilty; asking myself if I did something wrong to them and if that was the reason they were acting that way with me. I always reviewed and replayed the interaction in my mind and always came back to the same result. I never did anything negative other than request a service in a meaningful, friendly manner.

    Thanks Mr. Robertson for having taken the time out of your day to ask those questions. They were detailed and I only wish that the case worker whom I worked with was that thorough in his line of questioning with me.

    Have a good day,

    Cory

  10. Should read, “the responses to my questions were always fashioned in negative connotations…” instead of, “My responses were always fashioned in negative connotations.

  11. Salut, Mr Cameron, et merci. Take joy in being bilingual et profitez-en! La vie est belle.

  12. Merci, Monsieur Robertson pour votre temps cet apres midi. Et aussi, merci pour votre pleins de douceur.

  13. A lot of bickering about nothing, within 10 years French will be the 5th most spoken language in this country. And spaghetti will still be called spaghetti.

  14. @ P.J

    I wonder if you reached out to the 400,00 + quebec anglos that 4suffer daily as a result of the racist, anti-English laws enacted by quebec and ignored by Ottawa. How many former Montrealers and quebeckers have you expressed sympathy for, in light of the abuses they suffered at the hands of quebec nationalists.

    Garanteed answer, NONE. yet you make excuses for racist, anti-English postal workers for refusing to speak English .

    Your syrupy ,sugar coated diatribe that life is wonderful , illustrates you are indeed out of touch with the reality of this issue.

    Yes, be happy, don’t worry and ,apart from paying lip service to this issue, go on in a fantasy world you seem to exist in.

  15. Big D July 5, 2013 at 10:03 pm

    “A lot of bickering about nothing, within 10 years French will be the 5th most spoken language in this country. ”

    Yes this may be true but in 10 years at this pace of language legislation if you do not speak the” CHOSEN” language you will be as Trudeau said a lifetime of” job immobility ” as well as very,very,very limited opportunities .

    This all brought to you by your governments constant pandering to one minority,at the cost of your rights.

  16. Big D, even if French is 15th in 10 years, there will be more protections in place for French than English. Ontario has guaranteed funding for over 200 government institutions already that sign on to the French Language Services Act, there is a Ministry and many dedicated staff in place to only add more French, plus a Commissioner to do the same thing. Separate health clinics and schools and more and more jobs being listed “bilingual” without any kind of actual needs assessment.

    Do you know of any Francophones that need help from ALL taxpayers? The ones I know do OK for themselves.

    There certainly is a need to bicker.

  17. @ Cory. Did you manage to get that horrid French sign that was causing you so much distress removed from the side of the highway?

  18. Lets hope that the Ontario conservatives get rid of the pro french and pro spend liberal government.

    Hopefully Hudak will win and then maybe, just maybe a leadership review and Christine Ellliott will win.

    What we need is a MIKE Harris or Dany Williams type leader to stop the tide of french in Ontario and hopefully seriously consider adapting a policy to put in place an English version of bill 101 ,only add the provisions of bill 14 to the mix.

    After all, if its good for quebec, surly it can`t be bad for Ontario

    Right trembly, frutz ,stella and P.J

  19. Furtz July 6, 2013 at 7:22 am

    Antagonism from furtz there’s a surprise how about something constructive for once.
    But that requires taking a genuine interest rather then just to be an irritant to others here and on the freeholder.

  20. @ frutz

    Each and every French sign in Ontario should be removed and Ontario adopt a policy exactly the same as bill 101 in quebec

    After all, fair is fair eh frutz,

    Have a nice day eh

  21. Big D July 5, 2013 at 10:03 pm

    “A lot of bickering about nothing, within 10 years French will be the 5th most spoken language in this country. ”

    Big “D”. Please show us where you found these figures?

  22. In our house we speak Canadian. Not Quebecois. The language spoken in Quebec is not true French, but a bastardized form of it, just like the English is not true English, but a bastardized form of it.
    This crap from the Franco Canadian is accomplishing nothing but slowing down and in some cases even preventing any progress in our country. What’s next? Well, it would appear that those who speak true Panjabi or Mandarin are starting to outnumber those who speak Quebecois. We’re creating ghettos of language barriers by condoning this garbage and allowing the government to get away with the smoke and mirrors.
    If everyone in Canada had to learn the language of majority, Anglo Canadian which, incidentally is understood pretty much world wide for industry and commerce, we would be far more advanced economically and otherwise.
    Glad that I’m at an age where the law of averages tell me I probably won’t be around to see where all this garbage leads our children.

  23. Author

    Peter Tim Hudak to date has not said diddlysquat about language issues. He was not here supporting our nurses. Nada. THe Conservatives are not your party if you want language fairness.

  24. @ Admin

    Please read my comments further, Hudak is the first step ,to hopefully a Christine Elliot or Mike Harris, Dany Wlliams type of leader.

    I am also aware this will take many years, however, not only can it be done, but by making people aware now, the growth can come.

    Trudeau SR. and the like did not emerge on the scene overnight, nor did Mc Guinty. Events and demographics as well as laws and attitudes can change and change in a drastic manner.

    We are (The English) 28 million strong and we are waking up.
    Leadership and political will are the first steps. I recall in 1960, when the separatists first arrived on the scene , and no one, french or English ever took them seriously.

    Now look how they have come in their cause.

    If they can, we can. Once momentum starts, and it will, it is extremely difficult , if not impossible to stop.

  25. Great post fredinPrincetonBC on July 6, 2013 at 11:17 am
    fredin PrinstonBC wrote, “If everyone in Canada had to learn the language of majority, Anglo Canadian which, incidentally is understood pretty much world wide for industry and commerce, we would be far more advanced economically and otherwise.”

    “Some” (and i am sure you KNOW which group i mean) believe their language and culture is better and too much above the others and thus refuse to learn English and wish to force everyone else to learn their language to accommodate THEM.
    (–shhh, they are affriad of soemthing they call assimilation–)

    Of course, THEY say that the English people want everyone to accommodate them but, the simple fact is, THAT’S A DONE DEAL… Over time… It just happened that way and since it is and it’s become easy and “just the way things are” why not go with the flow and still keep your language and culture as a secondary thing like most everyone else IN THE WORLD is doing.

    English is just that much easier to learn and (as we see in the case of air traffic controllers) makes things workable world wide.
    —————–
    And re: your post admin July 6, 2013 at 11:18 am.
    You are right, the conservatives MAY not have shown up for the nurses but …
    Though they DO HAVE (i admit it) many faults as far as how they deal with poverty and the environment, the likely reason they have not shown a backbone with regard to this issue is simply because the ENGLISH PEOPLE themselves have not shown a backbone and demonstrated to the Conservatives that IF THEY DID stand up for the English “majority” then the English majority would stand up for them. (of course, this is relevant in reverse as well).
    That being said,
    Would the Lib – (French accent o the e)- rals or the Bloc-NDP have changed the name of the forces back to include the “Royal” part?

    Or would the Lib – (French accent o the e)- rals or the Bloc-NDP have put in place a unilingual English supreme court judge

    Or would the Lib – (French accent o the e)- rals or the Bloc-NDP have hired a unilingual English auditor general

    Or would the Lib – (French accent o the e)- rals or the Bloc-NDP taken down the French dominant art work from government buildings and replaced it with (though i am not necessarily a huge fan but) royal monarchy art work.

    Or would the Lib – (French accent o the e)- rals or the Bloc-NDP
    handed out HUGE ship building contracts (yes, i know there are some $$ issues BUT) to the more Anglo provinces and companies instead of bombardier and the other dominant French ones.

    The answer to all of this is NO and the answer to having the conservatives SHOW THE Angelo’s they have our backs is to show them in MASS numbers that we have theirs ON THIS ISSUE.
    Get off your duffs people they need to know we are out here and once they know then maybe they will realize that if they DO things in our favor and get flack for it that there is someone (the Anglophone MAJORITY in this country) out there that will stand up and say, we are in your corner , carry on.

    So admin, i guess i could say i agree with you while also disagreeing with you — and highlighting why and how we should work towards fixing it 🙂

    And fredinPrinctonBC also wrote, “Glad that I’m at an age where the law of averages tell me I probably won’t be around to see where all this garbage leads our children.”

    I feel the same way too but i cant bring myself to give in and not do everything i can to wake up the majority Anglophone Canadians to what is going on in the hopes that this can be stopped before it’s too late.

    WE THE PEOPLE…

  26. oops sorry for the typo’s in my previous message. Was to sleep late and to rise fairly early so i guess i am still a bit tired as the day goes on 🙂

    Most are obvious
    Lib – (French accent on the e)- rals or the Bloc-NDP
    and
    show the Anglo’s

  27. @ Highlander. My question was directed at Cory Cameron. Not you.
    @ Peter. Some Francophones are jerks. Therefore, we Anglophones should be jerks too? Also, The Conservatives will go nowhere with Hudak as their leader. Most people who support the party can even stand the guy.

  28. Oh and for the record.
    My previous post WAS NOT a blanket endorsement for the Conservatives PER SAY. It was just to point out that when one considers — what IS AVAILABLE — right now, the other two are what should be considered the foxes at the chicken coop door.

    No, i believe the ideal historically speaking right now would be a liberal minded party — on social and other issues — (as i believe most Canadians believe in these concepts) but with ZERO affiliation to the “French fact” in this country.

  29. Furtz,

    Over the last couple of days you have posted questions/concerns/comments to me and thus far I have avoided responding to you. For purposes of clarification, chronicling and responding to your inquiries of me, I have listed all of your blogs directed towards me on this forum thus far. I have listed them here from most recent to your first blog aimed at me:

    Furtz July 6, 2013 at 12:38 pm

    “@ Highlander. My question was directed at Cory Cameron. Not you.”

    Furtz July 6, 2013 at 7:22 am

    “@ Cory. Did you manage to get that horrid French sign that was causing you so much distress removed from the side of the highway?”

    Furtz July 3, 2013 at 5:39 pm

    “Thanks again Highlander, but Cory Cameron is way better at whining than I could ever be. He could teach a master course at Harvard. And he’d probably whine about that too. It’s in his genes, it seems.”

    Furtz July 3, 2013 at 2:26 pm

    “Does St. Lawrence College offer a course on whining, or is it a talent that one must be born with?”

    (I believe you were refering to my article on this above comment? Please feel free to correct me if I’m wrong on any subsequent posting you may decide to post).

    I appreciate and welcome any comments Furtz on any articles that I have written to CFN from anyone and everybody; including comments from those who may not agree with my take on things and whom may challenge me on it. I think that type of rapport with another blogger is both refreshing and challenging all at the same time. It gives us room and reason to pause and consider another’s take on issues. For an example of what I am refering to, I would like to cite my interactions with a one P.J Robertson that you may find most helpful as an aid to which I am talking about.

    As some bloggers on CFN can attest, I promised both them and myself several months ago that I would no longer engage nor read any commentaries from them should they contain insults, slights, or attacks directed towards me. Up to and including now, I have maintained that level of integrity.

    And, much to my unfortunate expectations, judging from the interactions and responses others have had with a few of them, I can see that their behaviour hasn’t changed for the better. This is evident from having read some of the responses my colleagues have generated towards them.

    And so, it is now that I would like to provide you with the following advice. Should you wish to garner my attention once again in the not-so-distant or even distant future and have a civil, educational, thought-provoking and beneficial interaction with me, please refrain from childish insults that will no doubt be a waste of both of our times and lead to more distasteful and divisiveness between our obvious varying viewpoints.

    And if by the chance that you don’t wish to abide by a common sense of decency in these blogging interactions, then please understand that this will be the final message from me directed towards you. I hope and wish this message to you is not seen as a call to war on any front.

    I trust you’ll consider this message in good taste and pray this message finds you in good spirits,

    With Kindest Regards,

    Cory Cameron

    Furtz July 3, 2013 at 5:39 pm

    Thanks again Highlander, but Cory Cameron is way better at whining than I could ever be. He could teach a master course at Harvard. And he’d probably whine about that too. It’s in his genes, it seems.

  30. First of all Tim Hudak will not touch the language issue, since that is noton the agenda of the Progressive Conservaties. So, anyone who trusts Hudak is in for a surprise.

    Secondly the term Franco Canadian should immedately be replaced with the term Franco-Amerindian which embraces people from their French side and their Amerindian side from every province and territory of Canada.

  31. I tend to agree that the provincial conservatives need a leader in order to move forward. A leader who does not disappear at election time and hand an unchallenged victory to the opponent.

  32. peter: Cory Cameron and I were enjoying a pleasant and constructive dialogue. So, unless you have something pleasant and constructive to add, kindly butt out……and while you are about it check the meaning of big words before you misuse them to spite others. As it happens, diatribe (“a forceful verbal attack; a piece of bitter criticism”– Canadian Oxford Dictionary) fits many of your posts to a T.

  33. Hudak (who d’at) is the cousin of McGuinty so don’t get your shorts up in knots.

    As for the French language yes it is slang and people of other countries cannot understand heads nor tails of the Québecois style of French and even the English spoken here is not the real English but an Americanized form of English.

    Soon you will all be turning your hate away from the French because soon you will have to learn the Chinese dialects of Mandarin and Cantonese and then what are you going to do. Canada is no longer Canada and is changing all the time. You will not have the French to hate and the UN is changing the world to make everything multicultural. That is good since it will remind me of the time of “the Tower of Babel” when people would speak and couldn’t understand one another and that will be one of the Good Lord’s punishments to the people who wish to hate one another and won’t be able to express themselves. LOL LOL. ROLF! I would love to see this happen. I would love to see what the people in Fossoli are going to do when they have a completely multicultural town and no English nor French to bicker with. This has to be something to see and it is coming sooner than people think.

  34. The Mike Harris conservatives totally ignored many requests to appeal bill 8 (the French language services act). Our elected officials decided to boycott the vote so only 55 out of 125 members passed the Flsa into law.
    Rather than doing their job by voting against it, they assisted by doing nothing.
    BTW the original bill was passed totally in the French language.
    If anyone thinks ANY party will change course you are sadly mistaken.

  35. @ Cory. Is that horrible French sign on highway 11 in northern Ontario still there? If so, is it still causing you misery every time you see it? It sure had your shorts in a knot a year or so ago. I’m just curious whether you were able to convince the powers that be to remove it.
    I’m totally flattered that you would take the time to search the interweb and copy/paste some of my comments here. I had no idea that you cared about my opinions. Thanks for that.
    One of the drawbacks of living and working in northern Ontario (like Cornwall) is that it was settled and is populated by lots of Francophone people. Have you ever considered moving to Alberta where you wouldn’t have to put up with the misery you are enduring?

  36. The double standard is overwhelmingly discriminatory.
    Cory is a bilingual Canadian whose right to be served in English is a trivial matter with no cause for complain while Michel Thibodeau ( also a bilingual Canadian ) receives cash rewards for his complaint. Why is a soft drink not trivial, stella?
    Not only did Mr. Thibodeau receive $6,000 but for the inconvenience, his wife got an additional $6,000. Did she ask for a seven up as well? Why should I or any other taxpayer pay HER?
    Not only does this reek of discrimination but it clearly shows the reality of the division that has been created.
    Those people that praise Thibodeau for his actions while dismissing the obvious bias will never change as the benefits are too lucrative.

  37. Bravo Jurgen, well said
    ON July 6, 2013 at 5:03 pm Jurgen wrote, “The double standard is overwhelmingly discriminatory.
    Cory is a bilingual Canadian whose right to be served in English is a trivial matter with no cause for complain while Michel Thibodeau ( also a bilingual Canadian ) receives cash rewards for his complaint.”

    And i must add. I posted a comment under one of the topics (not sure which one now) praising those who are out on the front lines of this issue and forgot to mention your name. I apologize for leaving out your name as you are indeed one of the forerunners of the fight to “try” to wake up the Anglo’s in this country to what is going on. If i forgot other names i apologize in advance as they are deserving also. To ALL of you i say, thank you. And don’t give up because more and more of us are coming on line to help out in whatever ways we can contribute.

    PS: These antagonists who jump on Cory and those like him for speaking up while at the same time praising the “Thibideau’s” are simply that NOTHING BUT antagonists and should be give ZERO attention. We know what needs to be done and we see where the injustice is.
    AND BTW Jules… it’s not a question of “hating the French” As i DO NOT hate the French. I could not hate the French as that would be hating my own mother and believe me I DO NOT and never could hate my own mother.
    I /we just DO NOT appreciate the double standard that is going on in MY /our COUNTRY. And also, “trying” to deflect to “other groups” as being “the REAL future threat is a waste of time as there is ZERO threat from them in the way we are discussing.
    They do not and will never control our government in the way the French do now. Which btw, MUST come to an end.

  38. Jurgen……what is the big deal?

    Any normal person who has no ulterior motives and is not trying to set someone up would have walked away.

    Of course the small c would strike up a conversation in English. By doing so, he was able to once again complain and claim to whoever is naïve enough to agree with him, that he was treated unfairly by this despicable French woman. It also gave him a reason to write another letter to the editor.

    It surely was a horrific experience. No human being should have to endure such humiliating and degrading treatment **smile**

  39. stellabystarlight, I assume you also mean Jean Lecompte should just walk away then ……and perhaps even dozens more at the various ACFO’s……????

    Jules, there is no hate for most of the people, it is policies, acts, regulations and politics that are the concern.

    You keep using the offensive term fossoli, which you had said your husband thought up months ago, here is the proof of the offensiveness. And “the proof is the proof, and when you get a good proof it is because it was proven”. Jean Chretien

    http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/judaica/ejud_0002_0007_0_06635.html

  40. @STELLABYSTARLIGHT

    July 6, 2013 at 8:44 pm.

    It is most interesting that you are such an expert on “normal” people and that your have such insight into how people should react given specific circumstances. You truly must be an enlightened and extremely well educated individual, certainly head and shoulders above the mere mortals who frequent this forum. TWO THUMBS UP !

  41. The Thibodeau’s have on a number of occasions sued ,and Air Canada was only one of many of their victims.
    One must remember Mr.Thibodeau is a federal government employee,and is fluently bilingual.

    A well payed Employee at that and maintains his vacationing budget throught these frivolous law suits.
    To think what this individuall has cost taxpayers not only for his wages but the numerous court costs as well as his benefits from suing!

    French rights groups have been advocating for behaviour like Mr. And Mrs Thibodeau for years now,demanding for French service even when the numbers do not warrant.

    Mr.Graham Fraser how about you do your job FULLY and assess Quebec’s bilingual services for at this point you only deal with the language issues outside of Quebec.

    TIME FOR GOVERNMENT TO GET OUT OF THE LANGUAGE BUSINESS AND LET MARKETS DECIDE RATHER THEN PROMOTE ALL OTHER LANGUAGES TO BE ASSIMILATED TO FRENCH.

  42. @STELLABYSTARLIGHT

    So, Mr. Thibodeau, by your own set of standards (or professional opinion?) was not a normal person. Yet the courts did not see this or despite of the abnormality of his condition (or due to, perhaps?) awarded him compensation.

    Therefore STELLABYSTARLIGHT you are suggesting that should Mr. Cameron take his complaint to court as Mr. Thibodeau did than he also is entitled to compensation by reasoning and actual case study (Thibodeau vs. Air Canada).

    I went back to Mr. Cameron’s LTE and could not find a reference to “this despicable french woman”. Do you in fact know this woman to be despicable? or were you only generalizing and merely suggesting that all french woman are despicable? Valuing your most educated and enlightened observations and opinions I anxiously await your intellectual response.

    My point herein, quite obviously, STELLABYSTARLIGHT is that sarcasm serves no other purpose than to be inflammatory and lowers the bar of intellectual discourse in this forum. You can grow up and put an end to your bullying and deliberate agitation and add value to the discussion or you can continue your playground antics, your choice obviously.

    At any rate, I need not go any further with you, I believe that my point has been well made and that most would agree with my logic.

  43. Bilingual or not, why would a person who gets so agitated by the sight of French signs, and the presence French speaking people, move to a town like Timmins where 41% of the population is Francophone?

  44. WOW…I’m overwhelmed.

    As I read the posts, It is blatantly perceivable that some
    have chosen the bluntness of democracy to express their positions.

    Much of the expressed opinions of this Language debate in my view,
    narrowly reflects the true reality of the French Canada.
    French does not only happen in Quebec. It’s all over CANADA.

    Much of what I’ve read have left me questioning the motives of some posters.

    Are they to make me understand that French should be eradicated?

    Am I to understand that in this democratic society that “WE” have built together, it should now be handed over to the English speakers?

    Am I to understand that some posters take offence and view some Laws are threatening to their personal or professional advancements ?

    Some posters have suggested that a National Referendum on the question of having Quebec separate from Confederation could achieve French eradication. It does not. What do you do with the other 5.000.000 French-speaking Canadian (Census 2006) living outside of Quebec. Burn them as well on “Eradication Day?”

    Others have suggested that it’s the “Trudeau Era Language Act” that holds the blame of their loss. Well this is truly inaccurate. If you think that this debate is the product of this generation I encourage you to read on to discover some FACTS.

    Quebec Act
    The Province of Quebec in 1774

    “With unrest growing in the colonies of the south, which would one day grow into the American Revolution, the British worried that the French-speaking might also support the growing rebellion. At the time, French-speaking Canadians formed
    the vast majority of the population of the province of Quebec (99%) and the British immigration was not growing well. To secure the allegiance of approximately 90,000 French-speaking Canadians to the British crown, first Governor James Murray and later Governor Guy Carleton promoted the need for change.

    There was also a need to compromise between the conflicting demands of the French-speaking Canadian subjects and those of newly arrived British subjects.These efforts by the colonial governors eventually resulted in enactment of the
    Quebec act of 1774.

    The Quebec Act provided the people of Quebec their first Charter of Rights and paved the way to later official recognition of the French language and French culture.The act also allowed Canadiens to maintain French Civil Law and sanctioned freedom
    of religion, allowing the Roman Catholic Church to remain, one of the first cases in history of state-sanctioned freedom of religious practice. Further, it restored the Ohio Valley to Quebec, reserving the territory for the fur trade. New France had thus been restored, so that it could play the same role as it did before the Conquest in North America.”

    So, in my humble opinion, the Linguistic debate was well on it’s way before Trudeau’s involvement or any Separatist Movement saw the light. When Quebec came to the table on July, 01st 1867 in Charlotte Town to join Confederation they arrived with the same Charter of Rights and Act that was decreed to them by the British in 1774.

    Based on the expression of sentiments posted by some, I truly believe that many of them further exemplify an unbalanced, prejudice claim of Rights from English-speaking Canadians
    over French-speaking Canadians.

    Am I to understand that this cohesive, Democratic bluntness expressed towards the French-speaking Canadians , should be perceived as an acceptable responsible use a democratic right?

    The common bias efforts and disorientation of the Rights and accomplishments of our fellow French-speaking Canadians, appears to be a shared thread. A complete non factual radical attack at others democratic Rights. In my opinion, such an unfair and destructive approach is not conducive in fostering a positive resolution.

    If the objective of posting was or is in some way to protect English-speaking Canadians from any future losses, may I respectfully suggest that you hurry yourselves in packing
    up this “Protectionism Debate” and moving it to TORONTO that is in far more danger of seeing English disappearing. The last Census shows only 59% as English-speaking. Chinese coming in at 2nd place at 14%. French threat only 1.4%

    Who knows there may be enough from this group, to form the first English Separatist group to protect the rights of the English-Speakers against the assimilation of English.

    The best advice I could give you based on what I learnt here, is nip it in the bud. Through them all out, if they don’t want to play by your English rules.

    In closing, let us seek our Rights and grow respectful and accommodating to others diversities and Rights.

    “Democracy is a blunt tool in itself.
    It waivers, it strays and can damage, when expressed as simple Right. The fine tuning, fairness and precision are in the hands of it’s ambassadors”

  45. David…thank-you!!! Your point has been made, and I appreciate it.

    It gives me a sense of freedom. You know what that means, right? It’s the thing you have been desperately fighting for that for 3 years now….freedom of speech **smile**

    Now FYI, I studied psychology and behavioral science. When dealing with immature behavior and there is NO HOPE FOR CHANGE, you go with the flow. How can one be serious when the subject matter is so ridiculous and immature.

    To answer your question, addressing the small c in French is one 0f the most despicable acts any human could face. I would go to the Supreme Court of Canada to fight this atrocity. No one but no one should be treated this way, not even Mr. Thibodeau.

  46. This message is directed towards CLF members:

    Kim and/or Beth, have either of you kept an eye on the enforcement of bilingual signs in the Embrun area? I know that the last time CFN reported on this, French organizations were neglecting to follow the municipal laws of the land in the area and were posting signs in French only. (And good for them too!)

    I just hope that English organizations can follow suit and do the same thing.

  47. Mr. Fraser has no power in Kebec.
    Bill 101 made sure of that so it begs the question of what is the real mandate of his office?
    We all know the answer and yet the same beat goes on and on with the answer always being “we need another billion”!
    The U of O restricts the number of English speakers in their enrolment policy and French courses are offered at a discount.
    This policy tells you all you need to know as they constantly refer to themselves as Canada’s university.

  48. Hungry for the Truth:

    I see no other ethnic group in Canada other than French ethnocentrics and separatists trying to legislate language though.
    This statement I make is in response to your:

    “If the objective of posting was or is in some way to protect English-speaking Canadians from any future losses, may I respectfully suggest that you hurry yourselves in packing
    up this “Protectionism Debate” and moving it to TORONTO that is in far more danger of seeing English disappearing. The last Census shows only 59% as English-speaking. Chinese coming in at 2nd place at 14%. French threat only 1.4%”

    If English is at 59% and use of the Chinese language coming in at 14%, I do not understand how our government (if language needs to be legislated to begin with), doesn’t allow for bilingualism to take root in Toronto with English and Chinese? Rather than English and French government services being bilingual in the area.

    And Hungry for the Truth, I see evidence of an undertone of chastising these Pro-English posters on CFN throughout your entire posting but no mention of the entire Pro-French/Anti-English camp that permeates the entire Province of Quebec
    and portions of Eastern Ontario that border the Province of Quebec.
    Moreover, does not legislating language not point to a form of social engineering in and of itself?

Leave a Reply