US Supreme Court Strikes Blow Against Gay Marriage Foes – Now Should we look at the Institution of Marriage? by Jamie Gilcig

US Supreme Court Strikes Blow Against Gay Marriage Foes –  Now Should we look at the Institution of Marriage? by Jamie Gilcig

jg2CFN – Today’s Supreme Court decision against  California’s Proposition 8 and  the federal Defense of Marriage Act will pave the way to Marriage Equality I think it’s time to ponder the actual state that Marriage is.

Is Marriage a lifelong commitment based on culture, religion and custom or simply a business contract between two parties?  Should it be forever? Should it be monogamous?  Should it have a best before date?  Prenups?  Offspring?  Pets?

I’ve always been a firm believer and supporter in equality; but I see far greater issues over what we consider Marriage to be than who gets to participate.

I personally waited until I was over 40 to marry.   I know that marriage isn’t all about happiness and contentment.  It’s hard work at times.  It’s not fun at times.  It’s about being able to make a choice and sticking to it and the sad reality is that it’s about two people ultimately making life choices that impact each other.

Being divorced after eight years has me jaded and disillusioned about the concept of Marriage, but also asking questions that I think others are asking too.

We live in a world where it’s simply too easy to marry and far too easy to divorce.    What is the point of Marriage if you can break it apart with the quick slash of a pen?

Those cliched vows of “til Death do us part, for sickness and in health, richer or poorer” do they not mean anything?

I used to marvel even at the concept of Marriage.  Imagine one person that fits almost everything in your life including who you like to have sex with?  It’s almost inconceivable; yet we humans have a need to couple.

Maybe once we’ve cleared up this debate about equality we can look at marriage and implications.

Maybe it should be harder to get married or maybe we simply need to redefine our concepts instead of just fattening up divorce lawyers.

What do you think CFN viewers?  You can post your comments below.

Roys Florist

 

58 Responses to "US Supreme Court Strikes Blow Against Gay Marriage Foes – Now Should we look at the Institution of Marriage? by Jamie Gilcig"

  1. mariah   June 26, 2013 at 11:33 AM

    My opinion is that we live in a throw away society & do not realize the value in fixing what is broke.It appears to be easier to just part ways & get along with your life.If we don,t learn our lesson chances are that we will repeat them til we do.We are not always being accountable & it is always easier to blame others.Talking out problems that are still fresh is getting more rare,we are allowing Government to tell us things that should be our decision alone like how to raise your children,what schools they should go to as well.We ourselves think that we have that almighty right to tell others what they should be doing or preventing them with hatred for those who disobey our concepts of how life should be lived.Gays have every right to marry the person that the wish to make a commitment to & raise children if they so desire.Some make better parents that a lot of people.Bottom line is when we find that person that we love as much as ourselves we must nurture & protect that union & not take it for granted,if its worth having in the first place it is also worthy of protecting & allowing it to grow.

  2. Pastor Tom Newton   June 26, 2013 at 12:08 PM

    Humanity can do what they want, but God’s word still stands. And upon this bases all will be judged, now and before the Great White Throne Judgment that is to come. From the Biblical record such an action of humanity is in fact the result of God giving up the Western nations to a mind void of understanding. We reject light and truth from the Scriptures, God rejects us, and gives us over to vile affections. It is only a matter of time when God will send other nations in to destroy physically such depraved, rebellious sinners. Jude 1:7 “as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them, in like manner to these, committing fornication, and going away after other flesh, laid down an example before-times, undergoing vengeance of everlasting fire”.

    1Co 6:9-11 “Or do you not know that unjust ones will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be led astray, neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor male prostitutes, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor covetous ones, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor plunderers shall inherit the kingdom of God. And some of you were these things, but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and in the Spirit of our God”.

  3. What???   June 26, 2013 at 3:17 PM

    @ Pastor Tom

    oh no, it’s you again…. I thought I wouldn’t see you again outside of the Superman thread.

    You’ve got no right telling anyone how to live their lives. Why don’t your kind take a long hard look within your own ranks before coming out here and judging people. We all know what kind of sexual acts are going in in your “brotherhood”

    @ Mariah

    Well put. I like your take on our generation throwing things away instead of fixing.

    @ Jamie

    In the case of my girlfriend and I, or common law partner as far as government is concerned, we look at it as “what does getting married do for us?” What is the purpose? We are very happy together. I hope to be with her until death claims one of us. I even selfishly hope it’s me first because I don’t want to think about what life would be like without her.

    But seriously, I don’t need the wedding for anything. We live our life together already. The wedding would just be more paper work and headaches if ever we do decide it’s best to part ways. If that day comes i’ll be upset enough.

    I figure we live together as long as it makes us both happy. If ever we move on, then we move on.

    I don’t like doing things for no reason. Like praying, right pastor Tom? 😉

  4. admin   June 26, 2013 at 3:21 PM

    What? That’s exactly why I wrote this piece. What is marriage any longer? If it is supposed to have meaning we should define it. If it’s something disposable I find that very sad and why do it? Now that it looks like we’ll have equality maybe it’s time for people to think about the institution in general and realize that if they do choose to be married that it should be something sacred and unbreakable….or not.

  5. Pastor Tom Newton   June 26, 2013 at 3:49 PM

    “What!!!” writes “We all know what kind of sexual acts are going in in your “brotherhood”. What kind of sexual acts might these all be? Besides the lawful, honorable sexual acts between a husband and wife, Tell us, I think we all would like to know.

  6. What???   June 26, 2013 at 5:08 PM

    Pastor Tom,

    Google the Cornwall public enquiry.

    If you are just too busy what with all the “preaching” you’ve got to do then just read this.

    Douglas Stamp, a Hamilton priest forced to step down from his job as a hospital chaplain this spring when a parishioner brought to light his 1997 conviction for indecently assaulting two 12-year-old boys in Peterborough, Ontario

    Hugh Vincent MacDonald, a retired Ontario priest, now faces multiple allegations of sexual abuse dating back to the early 1970s, when he was in the Cape Breton community of New Waterford. The accusations surfaced after David Martin, a Vancouver Island contractor, committed suicide in April, leaving behind a note detailing his experiences with MacDonald. The 80-year-old faced similar charges 15 years ago, but those were dismissed.

    A second priest from Cape Breton is also under investigation.
    Matthew Berko, a Ukrainian Catholic priest, stepped down from his parish in Florida after revelations that he had been convicted of sexually assaulting a 14-year-old female parishioner in Mississauga,

    In August 2006, Father Charles Henry Sylvestre, of Belle River Ontario plead guilty to 47 counts of sexual abuse on females, aged between nine and fourteen years old between 1952 and 1989.

    Paul Bailey, the Crown Attorney for Chatham Kent, reportedly described the case as being the “largest case of non-residential school sex abuse by a Roman Catholic priest” in North America. Local newspapers documented the lives of many of the women who refused the publication ban and spoke out about their abuse.

    It took me 3 minutes to find those just in Ontario. What would happen if I broadened the search to Canada, or even globally?

    Now I had to do this in the Superman thread and i’m gonna have to do it again here too. I’ve made more than enough points against you and i’m just gonna have to start ignoring you again.

    Jamie has some real thought provoking articles going on and I don’t want to turn all of them into Atheist vs you threads.

  7. Furtz   June 26, 2013 at 5:49 PM

    Hilarious!

  8. jules   June 26, 2013 at 7:37 PM

    Jamie I am having a lot of trouble getting into your site today. Something about cannot get into site address or something like that so I got in through Google this time.

    Marriage is a lifetime commitment between a man and a woman and not same sex marriage at all. I am one that holds the dear Lord up high as I can and try my best at my marriage. I have been married since 1974 and that is a long time indeed. We are growing old together and it does take a lot of work and we are kind of two opposites.

    We have had our ups and downs like everyone else but we got through them. We don’t wish for things that we cannot have. We are both from different cultures and I love our differences. Trying to figure him out is a real challenge more than it is for those of the same background – OH MY LORD INDEED IT IS A GREAT CHALLENGE. LOL LOL.

  9. Richard tremblay   June 26, 2013 at 7:46 PM

    live and let live I always say. Just because I’m heterosexual, doesn’t mean I have the right to tell a homosexual how to live his live and how to love his (or hers) significant other. My cousin is gay and you can’T find a more decent and caring person. He once asked me to go to a gay bar with him and he was worried how I would react if i got stared at or hit on. I said to him, heck I stare and flirt with women all the time. Let them stare

  10. jules   June 26, 2013 at 7:49 PM

    What??

    What you said about Catholic priests sexually abusing children is all true and I have read about what went on in Cornwall and the US and even Ireland but you cannot blame God for what people do. I have cried my eyes out at the computer reading what went on in Cornwall and what the filth of Cornwall did to Officer Perry Dunlop and I swear that I would never, ever return to live in Cornwall.

    About Pastor Tom Newton I think that he is a good man. I don’t compare God to superman, some comic character. God is the infinity and a perfect being.

    I am a Catholic and I consider myself more of a Christian after all what happened. I have seen some of my classmates back in Grade 3 and onwards who were sexually abused and when we had to go to the first Friday of the month at church I have witnessed horrible reactions of the young boys entering the church and had to leave because it was too much for them to handle. Everything is imprinted in my mind for the rest of my life. Everything that was in Ron Leroux and some other fellow’s writings were all true and much more than what they mentioned. I refuse to enter the church because of such filthy priests. It isn’t God’s fault and priests are human or should I say animals is the word that describes them best but something even lower than an animal. No decent person would do such a thing at all.

    I respect Pastor Newton and he comes out with Bible quotes but I do not like the superman thing – that is a kind of blasphemy. God is not a cartoon character made up by artists. You cannot compare the Good Lord to such garbage.

  11. jules   June 26, 2013 at 8:16 PM

    Pastor there is another thing that I want to say and to Jamie as well. My husband is from Beirut Lebanon and homosexuality, lesbianism, common law and all that is against God as well as the government. Anybody who is caught doing any of these things are whipped and jailed. There was a piece that I read on that just lately and yes this is done even among Christians. We are both staunch Christians. My husband is a Maronite Christian and I am a Catholic but I also bent towards a bit on the Protestant side and we have good friends who are Protestants as well and one couple is mighty religious and both are lay ministers.

    People in Lebanon who are gay are in hiding and some work in those bars as entertainment.

    My husband’s nephew just got separated from his wife just recently and they have 3 teenage daughters. I don’t know the story (the real story) of how all this has happened but it was a marriage doomed from the start. When my daughter went to visit her cousin down in Los Angeles CA when he lived there she found that he changed so much compared to what he was while living here in Canada and he was badly treated by her and her brother. Separation and divorce are not known in Lebanon and it happens more when people live here in the west but when they go back home they are not divorced because the government and the church do not honor that only for non Christians – Muslims.

    There was quite a big debate going on in Lebanon to be more westernized and the government overthrew it.

  12. What???   June 26, 2013 at 8:35 PM

    Jules

    See this will be tough to explain without upsetting you. I’ll start by saying i’m not trying to. I’ll let you believe what you will and i’ll believe what I will.

    I’m not blaming god for these assaults. That would be impossible because I do not in any way shape or form believe in God.

    I blame the people who do it. I brought up these events to put a certain pastor in his place for thinking he has any right to come out here and tell people how to live their lives. I want him to see that his own people are some of the most horrible monsters in existence.

    How are two people who love each other and want to be together a bad thing in any way?

    Because an ancient book that no one can prove is true says we should?

    Can I ask you how you personally feel about gay marriage? Even more than that, how do you feel about 2 people being gay?

    Some things are purely evil in this world. Murder, a video I saw of a man breaking into a home and savagely beating a woman in front of her 3 year old child without provocation.

    columbine, sandy hook, Luca Magnotta,

    That is wrong. That is evil. Do you think 2 people who love each other who want to symbolize that love through marriage is wrong?

  13. Pastor Tom Newton   June 26, 2013 at 8:43 PM

    What??? – Futz, yes “what” is Hilarious!

    “What” – you would not know a Protestant from a Roman Catholic even if one bit you. And I thought you had some real stuff on me, and Calvary Baptist Church. “What” sorry, you are in the dark, not even close.

    Ps. is this not the first, Furtz, that we agree on something? Something must be seriously wrong.

  14. Pastor Tom Newton   June 26, 2013 at 8:48 PM

    Jules writes – “We are both staunch Christians. My husband is a Maronite Christian and I am a Catholic but I also bent towards a bit on the Protestant side…” Then she writes in the next post- “I’m not blaming god for these assaults. That would be impossible because I do not in any way shape or form believe in God”.

    “I do not in any way shape or form believe in God” – a Christian that does not believe in God. Some thing wrong here, Jules?

  15. Pastor Tom Newton   June 26, 2013 at 8:50 PM

    Oh, I see, Jules is not saying “I do not in any way shape or form believe in God” it is “what” who wrote it. My apology Jules.

  16. jules   June 26, 2013 at 9:46 PM

    Pastor your apology is accepted. I thought that I would have to get my daughter’s glasses to see what you wrote. LOL LOL. No problem I just had a good laugh for the evening. Thank you.

  17. Pastor Tom Newton   June 27, 2013 at 7:12 AM

    “WHATCHAMACALLIT” writes – Do you think 2 people who love each other who want to symbolize that love through marriage is wrong? Yes, it is wrong!

    Love is not what defines what a marriage is. The Word of God calls immoral sexual love lust i.e. “vile affections”(Romans 1:26). Then there are those who add commitment to this lust, but a monogamous relationship is very rare for most sodomite couples. They switch partners often according to data that is available. And yes, heterosexuals are equally at fault for sex before marriage, and divorce. So it is not just a sodomite issue here when it comes to defining marriage.

    It is God that has instituted marriage and given it to His creation (See Matt. 19:4-6,9). Therefore as God has defined it as between one man and one woman for life, any thing else God calls an abomination and is dishonoring to Him, and to oneself.

    We can choice to ignore what God has instituted, but that not without suffering temporal and eternal consequences. God will not be mocked – Heb 13:4 “Marriage is honorable in all, and the bed undefiled; but God will judge fornicators and adulterers’.

  18. What???   June 27, 2013 at 9:40 AM

    Keep preaching Tom,

    It really doesn’t matter.

    This latest supreme court decision proves that people aren’t listening to your kind anymore.

    Your so called “rules” from your story book just aren’t going to be sticking around.

  19. Pastor Tom Newton   June 27, 2013 at 12:31 PM

    WHATCHAMACALLIT” writes “Your so called “rules” from your story book just aren’t going to be sticking around”. That is what the Roman Empire said, and then the Marxist, and yes, the Communist said that too, and now the secular humanist, but God’s Word is still here.

    Isa 40:6-8 “A voice said, Cry! And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all its grace as the flower of the field! The grass withers, the flower fades because the Spirit of Jehovah blows on it. Surely the people is grass. The grass withers; the flower fades; but the Word of our God shall rise forever”.

  20. What???   June 27, 2013 at 2:06 PM

    I hear more story book quotes being spit out. I see a pastor who still ignores all of the signs around him that his religion is on it’s way out the door.

    Above all I see yet another law that states, the bible’s view of things are wrong.

    Gay people are exactly that. PEOPLE. They are entitled to any of the rights than any other person has.

    Keep ignoring the fact or keep trying to spread your hate but the bottom line remains

    Equal rights for gay people is now the law. 😉

  21. Don Hunkerton   June 27, 2013 at 2:48 PM

    Just to clarify: Pastor, you’re saying political ideologies such as communism are the same as religion preference?

    Secular humanism contends that ethics and morality can be achieved without the belief in a god.

    Communism is an economic system that opposes the concept of private property

  22. Pastor Tom Newton   June 27, 2013 at 3:04 PM

    Is it not true that in communism, communism must become god? All for the state, and that is it.

  23. Hungry for the Truth....   June 27, 2013 at 3:38 PM

    @Tom Newton


    U.S. Protestants Face Sex Abuse Scandals, Too, but There Are Differences With Catholics
    TBO.com ^ | 4/4/02 | Richard N. Ostling
    Posted on April-04-02 1:16:26 PM by Tumbleweed_Connection
    The flood of sex abuse allegations against priests this year has focused attention on the Roman Catholic Church, but Protestant denominations have also faced sex scandals involving clergy.
    In fact, while data are sketchy, at least one expert believes the incidence of clergy molesting young children may be about as frequent – or infrequent – in Protestantism as it is in Catholicism.

    Others have found Protestant scandals have a tendency to surface in cases where male ministers are counseling women or teen-age girls, while the allegations against priests have frequently involved underage males.

    Penn State historian Philip Jenkins argued in his 1996 book, “Pedophiles and Priests,” that both secular and Catholic media exaggerate the extent of Catholic cases involving minors, while downplaying Protestant abuse.

    For instance, the Rev. Robert Eckert of Grand Rapids, Mich., a minister in the African Methodist Episcopal Church, was sent to prison in 2000 for sexual involvement with a 15-year-old girl who worked as his baby sitter – but the case received relatively little attention.

    Jenkins, an Episcopalian, thinks a 1992 survey from the Chicago Archdiocese is more representative of the true picture in Catholicism.

    Among 2,252 priests serving over four decades, 39 priests (1.7 percent) apparently abused minors. Only one abuser could be termed a pedophile under the strict, clinical definition of the word – meaning the victim was prepubescent.

    “I am prepared to be convinced the Catholics have a bigger problem” than Protestants, Jenkins said, but nobody has good data, partly because Protestant groups are too numerous. “I certainly haven’t seen anything, and I’m looking hard.”

    Minneapolis psychologist Gary Schoener agreed.

    “There are no real scientific data” on Protestants, he said. Since 1974, his Walk-In Counseling Center has been consulted on more than 2,000 cases of clergy sexual misconduct of all types, two-thirds of them with Protestants.

    He finds that sex with adult women or teen-age girls is the most frequent Protestant problem.

    In a typical Protestant case, a jury awarded $10 million in February to relatives of the late Deborah Yardley of Columbus, Ohio.

    The suit charged that the Rev. Steven Colliflower, a United Methodist, had an affair with Yardley when she sought his help with alcohol and emotional problems. He left the ministry shortly after she made the allegation. She later died of liver disease.

    The conservative World magazine says Protestantism faces a “severe problem” of clergy involvement with people the ministers are counseling, calling this “an egregious abuse of power.”

    Schoener said that clergy having sex with prepubescent victims is “very rare” in all denominations.

    A study of the Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.), covering eight states over six years, found 17 cases filed against clergy with 31 victims, all female, with one case involving a minor.

    There are also differences between Catholicism and the many Protestant faiths in the way sex abuse allegations are investigated.

    The U.S. Catholic bishops adopted a set of principles in 1992 calling for rapid response to allegations, openness with parishioners, care for victims and compliance with secular laws on reporting criminal conduct. But some Catholic bishops have admitted they didn’t always follow those guidelines.

    The Catholic principles also say a priest should be “promptly” suspended and referred for medical evaluation upon “sufficient evidence” of misconduct. The matter of reassignment is left open for a decision later.

    In the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, at least, events occur more rapidly.

    Bishop Donald McCoid of Pittsburgh, chair of the Conference of Bishops for the 5.1-million-member denomination, said when colleagues receive allegations against clergy “anything else on our agenda is dropped.” If a pastor admits the charge, he said, the bishop defrocks him within a day and refers charges involving minors to civil authorities.

    Another difference: Protestant lay officers – most of them mothers and fathers – exercise pivotal powers in supervising clergy. Catholic power is held almost completely by ordained bishops or religious superiors.

    Lutheran – as well as Methodist or Presbyterian clergy who claim innocence – are put on leave but can defend themselves through church trials and appeals.

    During debates over homosexual behavior, those three denominations have defined clergy standards that limit sexual conduct to heterosexual marriage and require chastity for singles.

    It’s difficult to assess the response to abuse accusations in Baptist and other denominations, where each local congregation handles cases.

    The most important example is the Southern Baptist Convention, the largest Protestant group in the United States with 101,000 clergy, double the total of U.S. Catholic priests and brothers. In the past decade, its press service reported two charges of molesting minors, against a youth worker and a martial arts teacher.

    But Dee Ann Miller of Council Bluffs, Iowa, says misconduct is more widespread.

    Since writing a 1993 book about her own abuse by a missionary in Africa, she has been told of allegations against 22 Southern Baptist clergy involved with minors, including six who molested prepubescent children.

    Miller charges that the denomination has ignored the problem. Sounding just like a Catholic activist, she said abuse will “only stop when laity get upset enough to hold their leaders responsible for incompetency.”

  24. Furtz   June 27, 2013 at 5:49 PM

    God Is Great! Or maybe not.
    Still hilarious.

  25. Pastor Tom Newton   June 27, 2013 at 6:00 PM

    “The most important example is the Southern Baptist Convention, the largest Protestant group in the United States with 101,000 clergy, double the total of U.S. Catholic priests and brothers. In the past decade, its press service reported two charges of molesting minors, against a youth worker and a martial arts teacher”.

    Just two, two to many for sure!

  26. Hungry for the Truth....   June 27, 2013 at 7:34 PM

    @ Tom Newton

    Just so we are clear SIR…… in response.

    Pastor Tom Newton
    June 27, 2013 at 6:00 pm

    “The most important example is the Southern Baptist Convention, the largest Protestant group in the United States with 101,000 clergy, double the total of U.S. Catholic priests and brothers. In the past decade, its press service reported two charges of molesting minors, against a youth worker and a martial arts teacher”.

    Just two, two to many for sure!

    So ….I’m going to forget at your suggestion the rest of the information and facts in this article because

    it does not seem to refute your earlier comments, your inference that Protestants are better than

    Catholics.

    Pastor Tom Newton

    June 26, 2013 at 3:49 pm

    “What!!!” writes “We all know what kind of sexual acts are going in in your “brotherhood”. What kind of sexual acts might these all be? Besides the lawful, honourable sexual acts between a husband and wife, Tell us, I think we all would like to know.

    Pastor Tom Newton

    June 26, 2013 at 8:43 pm

    What??? – Futz, yes “what” is Hilarious!

    “What” – you would not know a Protestant from a Roman Catholic even if one bit you. And I thought you had some real stuff on me, and Calvary Baptist Church. “What” sorry, you are in the dark, not even close.

    In my opinion, one can truly be selective about what they want the truth to be.

    Really not what it is. Ignoring the facts does not make it any less TRUE.

    Minneapolis psychologist Gary Schoener agreed.

    “There are no real scientific data” on Protestants, he said. Since 1974, his Walk-In Counseling Center has been consulted on more than 2,000 cases of clergy sexual misconduct of all types, two-thirds of them with Protestants.

  27. What???   June 27, 2013 at 9:10 PM

    Way to go Hungry for the truth!

    Jamie, heading back to your original train of thought.

    What you say is truly thought provoking. What is marriage anymore?

    With so many people moving away from religion but still wanting to be married anyway. You can get married by a judge in a ceremony with no religion at all. So it’s safe to say it’s not only a religious act.

    A large amount of these gay couples are going to want to get married FAR away from the religions that unjustly shun them.

    So if marriage is quickly becoming something more independent, then what is it exactly?

    A legally binding agreement to remain monogamous?

    A symbol of promise to remain with someone until death?

    Merely an old custom that people continue to use just because it’s how things have been for so long?

    A way of announcing that “This one is mine and everyone else must stay away?”

    We haven’t even scraped the surface of this topic yet.

    What about marriage being used as a method of self gain, like insurance money, or permission to immigrate?

    I know most of what i’m saying is basically what you say in the article. But it’s quite a topic. Maybe I can get the thread back on track for a while.

  28. Dave Windsor   June 27, 2013 at 10:02 PM

    I have read all of your posts. That is not to say I agree or disagree. You see, in this country we have a right to speak our mind, as Bill 13 has been rescinded by parliament.

    Thus to say, in my own view, there have been two or three core reasons why marriage has been failing in most aspects.

    1) COMMERCIALIZATION HAS OUT PRICED MARRIAGE to become that of middle to high income affordability……….and a show of hypocritical with those who can’t possibly go through a wedding unless it is outrageously expensive. In this way, the value of the wedding has become synonymous with the importance of it……. truly overshadowing any show of the osmosis of love.

    2) Social and formal media have exposed so many options for relationships from arranged marriages, marriages within your flock of different churches or one in and one non(atheist, agnostic) would fail as ‘unequally yoked’.

    A) Education…the belief that smart/intellectual rather than accepting of ‘FAITH BASED RELIGION’, attempts to resolve the amorality of marriage vs not marriage life styles.

    B) The attempt at equating ALL GENDER combinations of marriage as EQUAL perhaps has demeaned the value of marriage under the ‘former’ man/woman vision for life eternal style, purportedly under the sun, blessed by God as a holy matrimony.

    C) NEW AGE SECULARISM mentalities or modalities have taken secular directions with judges, courts being able to declare a marriage contract, or even a justice of the peace. Some take a course to allow the right on behalf of the province.

    These changes and more have added confusion to the madness causing upheavals and even revolutionary challenges as to what constitutes a marriage as such……..ie. 6 mos. co-habitation automatically makes a couple married for tax purposes and other social commitment reasons.

    So much confusion has brought society to the brink.

    God – no god. Love – no love (convenience of marriage…companionship w/separate rooms but tax and other benefits), living like brothers and/or sisters.

    Is it any wonder people are screwed up? is it any wonder that people have ‘forgotten God’. No more direction as secularism has hidden all vestiges of the 10 commandments for example. An other issue is the elimination of mom and/or dad any more with for example that Mothers Day and Fathers Day celebrations have now become only ‘Parent Day’…….gender neutrality.

    It is difficult to go to church anymore as the new term ‘sick people go to church’ as if ‘sick in the head’ people only need to go. Faith based religions as John 3:16, for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that you may be saved’, but media hits you everywhere and it is very difficult to become ‘of the world’ for the average person.

    So many parent-less or mis-guided parents that everyone uses their own ‘wits’ to get on with their lives and end up allowing the ‘flesh’ or rather their ‘feeling’ give them direction when it comes to finding a partner or partners, being straight or bi, or other, monogamous or well trave-led.

    The homosexual/lesbian crowed, with gay pride, the courts ruling in their favor, the demand they be able not just to get married, but to even equate heterosexual marriage as equal in every way.

    Now we are truly in an upside down era where right has become wrong, up is now down. Isn’t it coincidental to prophesies the age old testaments from thousand year before us?

    Where from here? Your guess is as good as mine, friends. Your right may be my wrong and vis-a-versa.

    Have a nice life….maybe we’ll see you on the other side.

  29. Pastor Tom Newton   June 28, 2013 at 7:04 AM

    Dave Windsor writes – “Where from here? Your guess is as good as mine, friends. Your right may be my wrong and vis-a-versa”. We can blame secularism of our world for the mess, but as they say -“the chickens comes home to roost”, the source of the problem is found in what we call “the local church”. How about we start with -2Ch 7:14 “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land”.

    If we have failed to be the light and the salt of the earth, why should we be surprised if the world around us is in an advance stage of moral corruption? Is not their blood on our hands? How many so called Christians actually believes and obeys God’s Word out of a changed heart of love? It can never be do as I say, but don’t do as I do.

    Luke 6:46 “And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?”

  30. silentfrancoamerican   June 28, 2013 at 8:48 AM

    Its been said in the Vatican that its an english world problem and they should of remained in Latin language.There is no such thing and an english speaking catholic country. In north america Quebec is the only place where boys are boys and girls are girls and treated as so. This is a cultural problem,its an english problem lack of masochism.If you want a survey go to (pickle park),sorry i mean where they cut down the bushes.

  31. What???   June 28, 2013 at 8:55 AM

    Tom, I would like to hear in your own words. NOT from another bible passage, what is wrong with 2 people of the same sex loving each other.

    Can you honestly give me one valid reason aside from “God says it’s wrong?”

    I doubt you can.

  32. Pastor Tom Newton   June 28, 2013 at 10:17 AM

    “WHATCHAMACALLIT” writes – “Can you honestly give me one valid reason aside from “God says it’s wrong?”

    Well, God said it, that settles it. It is not “thus saith Tom”, but “Thus saith the LORD”! My opinion is worthless, and has absolute no authority, but that is not true of the Word of God. So like it or not, that is how it is – Lev 18:22 “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination”.

  33. What???   June 28, 2013 at 12:36 PM

    See?

    Exactly my point!

    You are unable to give a single reason why it’s wrong aside from the fact that “your lord says so”.

    Sickening, hateful, and repulsive.

    So using your own logic. Although someone once coined that phrase “You can’t argue logic with religious people. If you could there would be no religious people”

    but i’ll ask anyway. In your own logic, how can you expect a community that believes less and less in your religion because of how many times it has been disproven, and how much hate it creates, how do you expect these people to NOT start legalizing gay marriage.

    You say “”Like it or not that’s how it is”

    No Tom. Just no. That’s NOT how it is.

    The people have spoken. The law says homosexuality is legal. The law says marriage between homosexuals is legal, and now the law says all married homosexuals will be treated just like a heterosexual married couple.

    So like it or not THAT’S how it is.

  34. Pastor Tom Newton   June 28, 2013 at 2:34 PM

    Hungry for the Truth…. I am quite aware of the corruption in both Roman Catholic and Protestant areas. My reply was basically with a local spin in mind. The way that “what?????” was writing, I thought he knew something about Calvary Baptist Church that needed to be dealt with. Though the source is very doubtful and I am not surely the last one to know what is going on in my local church.

    Also again with a local spin, as far as I know, Project Truth was about local Roman Catholics priests, and not any protestant ministers in the area. So locally, if that is any comfort and consolation, Protestants are doing better then the nation average. Statistics are funny things. Your source is outdated for sure. Things in fact have not gotten any better, but worse. You see both in the pulpit and in the pew, everyone is doing it, and many approve of it.

    I believe that any clergy caught in such wicked sin, should be dealt with by their church and reported to the authorities. But I would want the same standard for school teachers, care givers, etc. or anyone in a position of trust. Presently, some Ontario teachers where let off the hook, and has returned to their teaching positions, while their deviate sexual behavior has been applauded, rather than condemned. Is clergy the only ones that should know that such sexual immorality and wickedness is wrong? Only the clergy is to be hold to the fire? It can never be – do as I say, but don’t do as I do!

    One last point, I know that it is natural to throw out the baby with the bath water, seeing the general trend of religion in Western society. But the Lord Jesus said – Mat 7:13-14 “Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it”. “Few” there be that find it”. The condition of the days we are in before the second coming of Christ has been foretold long ago. They are days of total rebellion, and complete moral break down. “As in the days of Noah, so shall be the coming of the Son of Man…”, but the fault lies with sinful man, not God. The Lord Jesus still says – Mat 11:28-30 “Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light”.

  35. jules   June 28, 2013 at 4:50 PM

    Pastor Newton you wrote just exactly everything perfect. It wasn’t just the Catholic priests involved in all of this sexual deviation but doctors, lawyers, social workers, police, etc. including the ordinary person on the street. When it comes to priests, ministers of the church (protestant) or other, lawyers, social workers, doctors and others that you put your trust into and then you find out that there is no more trust then who do you trust. It is a grave sin no matter what faith.

    I am so happy that you quoted Mathew 11:28-30 from the Bible and people don’t know the hell that is coming for all of us who turn our backs on God and His commandments. We cannot be perfect people but we must do our best to adhere to those commandments as best as we can.

    I truly enjoy what you write and wish to thank you so very much.

  36. jules   June 28, 2013 at 4:55 PM

    What?? There is no law on this earth that is above God’s law and I will tell you something. God is going to punish the people very much so and anybody who doesn’t believe in the Supreme Being God will taste His wrath.

    Homosexuality, sex before marriage and a whole slew of things are sins and people are going to be pushed for them. If you are an aetheist you will deal with God.

    You should not call Pastor Tom Newton by his given name but Pastor by his title. That is rude What??

  37. jules   June 28, 2013 at 5:10 PM

    Mr. Windsor nobody has to be rich to get married. All one has to do is make it simple. I got married in the Catholic church back in 74 and I made my own wedding dress (kind of ugly) and I borrowed another lady’s veil that she wore and we only had the immediate family, no friends or anything. All we had was $900. to our name. We lived in basement apartments in people’s homes in Cornwall before coming to Ottawa. While in Ottawa we lived downtown in a run down Chinese neighborhood with a resident rat (yes the one on 4 legs) LOL LOL. You haven’t tasted or smelled real Chinese food – we smelled it and YUCK! We lived there for a little over a year before landing in this building, first in a one bedroom and then in this very same 2 bedroom and this is luxury compared to where we lived.

    When we moved to Ottawa from Cornwall in the mid 70’s my mother stood on the porch and cried her eyes out to see how we moved in a small rental van. When we arrived in Ottawa we went the wrong way on Albert Street since it was only one way and the bus driver waving his hands at us like you would not believe.

    Nobody has to go to a justice of the peace to get married just because they don’t have the big money.

  38. What???   June 28, 2013 at 6:05 PM

    Jules, you say

    “What?? There is no law on this earth that is above God’s law and I will tell you something. God is going to punish the people very much so and anybody who doesn’t believe in the Supreme Being God will taste His wrath.”

    If you choose to believe in a sky friend who will one day come down and massacre everybody for not listening to his “laws” then you go right ahead. The fact of the matter is, to us atheists who do not believe in this joke, we are not at all afraid of this empty threat. We actually laugh at your kind for being so absurd.

    It actually says a lot about you that you would welcome such mass killing of humans.

    Also, in my opinion, EVERY law is above god’s law. If you went out and broke any one of our laws today. REAL LAWS. Steal, kill, vandalize, molest, go to court and try and argue that it was god’s will and see what will happen to you. God’s law won’t save you from anything. The more you look into it the more you see god’s law means nothing.

    “Homosexuality, sex before marriage and a whole slew of things are sins and people are going to be pushed for them. If you are an aetheist you will deal with God.”

    So you are calling them “sins”.

    A sin by definition, is “A transgression of a religious law, especially when deliberate.”

    So why would any non religious person care at all if they violate a law that belongs to a religion they don’t believe in?

    Sinning, and doing something wrong or immoral can be 2 very different things. Just because your story books says it’s wrong. It doesn’t make it so. I’ll say again, there is nothing wrong with 2 people of the same sex to enjoy the exact same freedoms as anyone else. There is not a single logical reason why they shouldn’t aside from the ancient book that no one can prove any of is real.

    That’s not a reason at all.

    “You should not call Pastor Tom Newton by his given name but Pastor by his title. That is rude What??”

    I don’t recognize Tom’s religion so I recognize his “title” even less.

    What is rude, is trying to tell people they will suffer a horrible death for not believing in the same things you do.

  39. Cory Cameron   June 28, 2013 at 6:42 PM

    Wow, it’s actually mind boggling to see the differences in opinion between the Generation gaps.

    Keep in mind that this generation is the most educated to date and hopefully each successive one will be even greater educated.

    The more education comes into play it seems that the less and less people rely on religion to explain away such seemingly mundane, everyday things.

    Now, I’m not a religious person per se but I do think that nature is glorious in all it’s splendour…and what’s more, it seems that something created it according to some grand design. Perhaps this is part of the Romantic in me. But please excuse me for this fault…

    I’m not labeling this ‘something’ as a deity, God, Christ, Mohammed or any other human percieved notion of an Almighty.

    But I’m reminded of a telltale saying amongst soldiers of all nations:

    “That there are no Atheists in foxholes.”

    What we as people need to keep in mind is that we are dependent on nature and not vice-versa.

    Having said as much, we are the caretakers of this world and need to respect both each other and all of it’s inhabitants. And no worries there, the earth eventually rid’s itself of anything that harms it in the long run.

  40. Hungry for the Truth....   June 28, 2013 at 7:14 PM

    Pastor Tom Newton June 28, 2013 at 2:34 pm

    Hungry for the Truth…. I am quite aware of the corruption in both Roman Catholic and Protestant areas. My reply was basically with a local spin in mind. The way that “what?????” was writing, I thought he knew something about Calvary Baptist Church that needed to be dealt with. Though the source is very doubtful and I am not surely the last one to know what is going on in my local church.

    In response to your local spin…I understand that your local chapter of the hundreds of Baptist theologies, that your local leadership may not have been exposed to any allegations but this respectfully, does not give you anymore MORAL authority than those associated to the Protestant theological belief. Is that not the same way you would want all Gays to feel? “Guilt by association for their sinful behaviour” . All in the same bucket.

    Rev Tom Newton…

    “Also again with a local spin, as far as I know, Project Truth was about local Roman Catholics priests, and not any protestant ministers in the area. So locally, if that is any comfort and consolation, Protestants are doing better then the nation average. Statistics are funny things. Your source is outdated for sure. Things in fact have not gotten any better, but worse. You see both in the pulpit and in the pew, everyone is doing it, and many approve of it.”

    Just to clarify a few nonfactual misconceptions in the above paragraph the you seem to state as the gospel truth. “Project Truth was about local Catholic priests”’

    I rather factually understand sir, that is was about “Institutional Response” not only to deal with historical allegations involving Roman Catholic Priests, but also included all Institutions involved. Your comment about, “Your source being outdated” . Whether or not it happened in 2002 or yesterday the FACTS are the same …IT HAPPENED and as you say, “Things in fact have not gotten any better, but worse. You see both in the pulpit and in the pew, everyone is doing it, and many approve of it”.

    Rev Tom Newton…..

    “I believe that any clergy caught in such wicked sin, should be dealt with by their church and reported to the authorities. But I would want the same standard for school teachers, care givers, etc. or anyone in a position of trust. Presently, some Ontario teachers where let off the hook, and has returned to their teaching positions, while their deviate sexual behavior has been applauded, rather than condemned. Is clergy the only ones that should know that such sexual immorality and wickedness is wrong? Only the clergy is to be hold to the fire? It can never be – do as I say, but don’t do as I do!”

    In fact these are very good points that you make. To use your expression “Local Spin” well as a result of Project Truth’s findings and recommendations after hearing thousands of hours of testimony, not only from the Roman Catholic Church but also,

    Ministry of correctional Services (Probation Officers)

    Children’s Aid Society (Foster Care Caregivers)

    School Boards (Teachers)

    VICTIMS from (all involved institutions)

    they clearly participated in the development of Protocols to bring these perpetrators OPPPSS…., SINNERS to justice. SO…. really… “Is clergy the only ones that should know that such sexual immorality and wickedness is wrong”? “PROJECT TRUTH” was not only about “ROMAN CATHOLIC PRIEST” VS PROTESTANT CLERGY ?

    In closing Rev Pastor, I end with my ever growing belief that like much of the theological rhetoric being exchange here… that , “Ignoring or misleading the FACTS does not make a VIABLE undisputed opinion.

    PS …And I haven’t gotten into GAY MARRIAGE yet….Or inaccurate views and bias hate filled opinions on homosexuality. Another day maybe??? Right now I hear my common-law partner calling….Oh no now I’m going to hell for sure or maybe not.. because I don’t see alot of persecution about this SIN in your views.

    Last Stats Can 2011 43% of CANADA are living in SIN ( premarital sex ) according to the same

    BOOK of SCRIPTURE condemning homosexuals to hell.

    It’s easier I presume in my opinion to single out a minority than a majority. It fills the collection baskets in a less damaging way. It might be my opinion, but it could also be a debatable real FACT.

  41. What???   June 28, 2013 at 7:16 PM

    Cory,

    Now that was a well written piece.

    There is something worth praising. The world around us. People take so many things for granted. It’s so rare to see people truly appreciate the things that keep us alive. Clean air which we see so little of these days in our crammed cities of pollution. Even worse, all the youth’s who spend all summer in their parents basements playing video games. No appreciation for the sun or the air that we couldn’t live without.

    The tree that keeps the air clean or the animal that had to die so that you could eat and stay alive. People today will reach for a pizza pocket and a pepsi and not be thankful for anything. A very select few truly respect the things that keep us alive.

    I love your comment about a grand design. I hate to quote something so cliche, but the line from Jurassic park I always thought was fantastic.

    “Life finds a way”

    That’s my impression of how it works. I feel like the entire universe, attempts to support life. It tries to create planets within habitable zones around suns.

    Even when we scale it down to just our planet. Researchers believe all life has been wiped out more than once on earth but it finds a way to start over. To reignite that one celled organism and start the evolution over again.

    Water creatures growing legs when there is a water shortage. Evolution of animals making them more efficient hunters. THAT is truly amazing.

    Then again maybe i’m wrong. Maybe the entire universe was just a fluke or an accident caused by a couple molecules touching each other at the right temperature.

    Nobody knows. Maybe one day we will.

    THAT, is exciting.

  42. Pastor Tom Newton   June 28, 2013 at 8:06 PM

    Imagine – not very scientific -“Then again maybe i’m wrong. Maybe the entire universe was just a fluke or an accident caused by a couple molecules touching each other at the right temperature”. How romantic- “a couple molecules touching each other at the right temperature”. I just love blind faith in science! No matter how you slice it – spontaneous regeneration, something out of nothing. Life out of non-living matter. What a miracle! Almost makes me a believer.

    Hebrew 11:3 “Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear”.

  43. What???   June 28, 2013 at 8:47 PM

    LOL!

    Did I seriously just see a pastor criticize blind faith?

    Now that is hilarious.

    Since you’re still not tired of getting slammed after every single post you make, then i’ll slam you again Tom.

    Blind faith is what your religion does. Not science.

    Science doesn’t have every piece of the puzzle yet. But it has strong evidence, facts and proof showing is on the right trail.

    There isn’t a single piece of evidence out there suggesting life and earth is a divine creation.

    What does your religion have? Not a thing! Let’s see one shred a proof that your sky friend exists. That heaven exists or the devil exists.

    Oh that’s right, there is no proof. The only way you’ll ever see it is after you die. How convenient. That dear Tom is blind faith. Not what we do.

    Ha! Criticizing blind faith that’s too funny!

  44. jules   June 30, 2013 at 9:22 PM

    “What??”

    I am not of Pastor Tom’s faith and I have great respect for the man. I don’t have to practice the same doctrine but I respect everything that he does because he is God’s servant and it is too bad that you and a lot of your generation who are a lost generation have become aetheist. You are a lost generation and that is the real truth. I pity the young people today and I know that things are getting a great deal worse both economically and morally and that is exactly what the Bible states.

  45. Dave Windsor   June 30, 2013 at 10:53 PM

    DOES THE ‘HOLY SPIRIT’ MEAN ANYTHING FOR YOUR RELATIONSHIP?

    Relative to all of this, I would like to see a full discussion on “the Holy Spirit” as each of YOU see it………….

    It would I assume, almost impossible for an aesthetic to have any conception of what this is.

    Certainly, those who embody the H.S. have indeed changed their lives.

    No question that to a bonifide church ordained, heterosexual sanctioned ‘marriage’ couple believes that their vision of marriage has been hijacked by the gay/pride crowd.

    To them, marriage means the same thing………..however they do not and cannot perceive the fact of a ‘holy spirit’ enhanced marriage, unless they believe they can hijack this as well.

    So, in essence we have a stalemate over a word…….a word now with two or even more meanings to different groups. If one group presupposes theirs is the same as all else or ‘heaven’ forbide place theirs on an even higher plain, well, that’s when all ‘hell’ on earth breaks out.

    This never ending conundrum of he said, she said has implicitly been resolved under the LAW of the land, but never in the hearts and minds of mankind.

    Can each ‘group’ in fact call themselves married then still annoint it as a version of their own, telling their own story.

    Without some form of acceptable nuance fitting for each, this problem will never be resolved by mankind.

    For courts to institute its edicts and laws for man, never can or will they legislate the hearts of men.

    ‘The Holy Spirit’ then is enshrined into the minds and hearts of some, as some who think they are so blessed, and those who are in complete denial. So be it then, essentially three mind sets. Pick your own and move on your own way, let or not let God be your guide.

    Time to give this never ending story a break I think.

  46. What???   July 1, 2013 at 7:48 AM

    Jules says:

    “You are a lost generation and that is the real truth. I pity the young people today and I know that things are getting a great deal worse both economically and morally and that is exactly what the Bible states.”

    This is complete ignorance Jules. If you are suggesting that it is because we choose not to believe in religion that the economy is having a rough time then you really need to open your eyes.

    Some of the richest, smartest and most successful people today are atheists. Others are very religious.

    Even saying that there is less morality because we choose to be atheists is ridiculous.

    There are morally sound people and morally incapable people both on the religious side AND on the atheist side. Religion is not the deciding factor. It is the individual.

    Don’t pity atheists. Pity people who can’t tell good from bad, who have no regard for life, or who can’t function enough to be a contributing member of society.

  47. Pastor Tom Newton   July 1, 2013 at 7:58 AM

    David writes -“Without some form of acceptable nuance fitting for each, this problem will never be resolved by mankind”. The author of the Inspired Scriptures is God Holy Spirit. And what He has given to us says – Lev 18:22 “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination”.

    In the New Testament Scriptures we have the same probation – what is considered sin, immoral, and perverted in the Old Testament Scriptures, is considered sin, immoral, and perversion in the New. God has not changed His mind. (See 1 Cor. 6:9-11).

    So what agreement, concord does light have with darkness? “So, in essence we have a stalemate over a word…….” Not so at all –

    Matthew 19:4-6 ” But answering, He said to them (the Lord Jesus speaking – Son of God), Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning “created them male and female”? (Gen. 1:27) And He said, “For this reason a man shall leave father and mother, and shall be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.” (Gen. 2:24) So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has joined together, let not man separate”.

    God instituted marriage, and He defines it. No other way is honoring to God, nor correct in His thinking, no matter what His creation comes up with. Pretty clear, with and without the God – Holy Spirit’s enlightenment.

  48. Highlander   July 1, 2013 at 9:44 AM

    Yes this story has very interesting dialogue

    Furtz on the standard freeholder ISLAM: Muslims, dogs and ritual purity

    “If anyone is interested, Sherlock at CFN is hosting some serious gay-bashing and English supremest French-bashing on his site right now. Nothing like a bible-thumping hate monger and a bunch of whining English freedom-fighters to keep a leaking boat afloat.”

    I do find it interesting as this Furtz individual defines this in depth conversation of Gay Marriage and the institution of Marriage as gay bashing .

    There are opposing views to a subject that may be sensitive to some ,but as always dialogue such as these comments are very interesting with many a scope of idea’s and viewpoints.

    Is one viewpoint to be “oppressed” because it may not serve the interest of some.

    I believe that this furtz person is not a true believer of freedom of expression ,different viewpoints should be welcomed as it serves to inform .

    FURTZ I had not realized a teenager having her rights violated and speaking up for this is considered”French bashing “was it not her that was “English bashed”-certainly a warped perception you have!

    Happy Canada day people ,Those freedoms we have on here as well in our country are thanks to all those that fought for them.

  49. Hungry for the Truth....   July 1, 2013 at 10:06 AM

    When discrimination against a certain populous of the population
    is inflicted, many time it is at the hands of groups or individuals,
    that use fear and misguided information to fuel the disagreement.

    History has many truths and facts for those who seek them. They are not
    always found exclusively in THE BOOK. Men of the times claim to have been
    inspired by the Holy Spirit, and have included some interpretations and laws
    of their own. It then becomes GOD’S word interpreted by…..a good example
    of this is, “The Trent Council” and of course “Vatican II.”

    Marriage has evolved over the centuries, but some basic features
    have remained constant. In ancient Rome, it was accomplished by
    consent of the parties to live together. No forms were required,
    and no ceremony was necessary. This early Roman model of marriage
    was displaced when the Catholic Church declared in 1563 that marriages
    were not valid unless contracted in the presence of a priest and two
    witnesses.

    In England, under the Anglican Church, marriage by consent
    and cohabitation was valid until the passage of Lord Hardwicke’s
    Act in 1753. This act instituted certain requirements for marriage,
    including the performance of a religious ceremony observed by witnesses.
    The American colonies rejected the requirement of a religious ceremony
    but retained the custom of a ceremony, religious or otherwise.

    The ancient Roman concept of marriage by agreement and cohabitation
    was adopted by early American courts as valid under the common law.
    In the 1800s, state legislatures began to enact laws expressly to prohibit
    marriage without an observed ceremony and other requirements.

    Several reasons have been offered for recognizing common-law marriage.
    In some states, including Pennsylvania and Rhode Island, common-law
    marriage was originally permitted to allow for RELIGIOUS and SOCIAL FREEDOM.
    Some state legislatures have noted the private importance of marriage and
    assailed the insensitivity of governments purporting to regulate such a personal
    matter. Other states have been reluctant to require licensing and ceremony in
    consideration of the financial hardship such requirements impose on poor citizens.

    The sanctity and religious definition of marriage have been at the core of
    the debate in the fight to equal rights in the same sex Union. It is not the gays and
    lesbian of this debate that was seeking to change or modify the sanctity
    of religious definitions.

    The religious officiator have always been obligated by Law to be it’s Legal
    representative. So, therefore have always had a two fold obligation. Built into
    the religious ceremony the Legal have always been required. ( The Marriage Licence)

    A union of two people is not formalized by law unless officiated by an official
    Lawful representative and is witnessed by 2 witnesses.

    A fundamental question in marriage is whether the union is legally recognized.
    This question is important because marriage affects property ownership,
    rights of survivorship, spousal benefits, and other marital amenities. With so
    much at stake, marriage has become a matter regulated by law.

    It was not and is not the religious definition that was being debated, it is
    the legal obligation requirements that church have agreed to over the centuries.

    All the power to those who chose the historical definition of marriage. But in my
    view it should not squash nor deprive others that chooses to adhere to the prescribed
    protection of the Law that is granted to all in our religious and social freedoms.

  50. Furtz   July 1, 2013 at 1:11 PM

    @ Highlander. Thanks for the quote. I’m flattered, and I stand by it.
    Happy Canada Day!
    Carry on.

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