South Stormont ON – I have become inutterably tired of the complaints about taxes at the provincial level of government. So few of the complainants appear worried about the massive tax waste occurring at the federal level yet taxes are taxes no matter who levies them. More importantly we have to see when and how we benefit from our taxes. I am a senior citizen on a fixed income after losing my life savings defending my name in a law suit brought about by the RCMP. That I won the case is of little solace when compared to the financial cost.
Despite my own awareness of having to live close to the bone, so to speak, I do recognize that in a democracy taxes are all important. Without taxes we would have none of the services we take for granted as our lives pass through one day into another. There would be no good road systems; no hospitals or medical services, no snow ploughing in the winter months, no police services and anarchy would reign. Then the complainers would be out in force.
A classic example of the complaining demonstrates how little the complainers understand. The HST on our electricty bills is a major irritant because of ignorance. The HST on our electricity bills is not just for the electrical power we consume. The HST taxes go into the general revenue fund that is applied to all the taxation needs our society requires.
It matters not the political stripe of the government since all governments require sufficient funds to make the system work. In fact, it should be noted that the opposition parties to the present Ontario government, whilst complaining about the HST, HAVE NOT UNDERTAKEN TO REMOVE IT if they are called upon to replace this government.
Please stop the whining and get on with enjoying the beautiful life our Canadian democracy provides. There is truly a silver lining behind every cloud and that is what we should be looking for. Above all, we must remember that our democracy demands sound opposition parties if it is to remain viable. It is because we do have sound opposition parties that we can be sure this province is on a sound footing.
John E. Milnes – South Stormont
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I am sure many like me and you understand the need for tax. People often complain over any change, however we are seeing more complaining because of two things. One is so many are at or near meeting the upper end of a disposable spending amount that will be or is being reduced to pay tax.
Another more in depth look of the complaining, is that it is our way of showing our displeasure with government spending. Really, Should the provincial government be giving 40 million dollars to foreign students when we still have homeless, underfed and senoir’s scraping by?
Governments get more than they need now, we have to many programs and people are getting fed up!
Without complaints, things will get worse.
I think you’re onto something Eric. I think fundementally people feel they are being royally screwed over by governments at all levels and when you have a recession those sentiments boil the loudest.
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Sadly the less people that vote the higher our taxes seem to get…..
I am not against taxes, but I am against regressive taxes. During a time of recession, HST is the wrong tax at the wrong time. It’s a tax that disproportionately hurts the working poor. HST hurts families, seniors, and it hurts businesses too because it is a consumption tax. Shoppers and tourist are more likely to spend money in New York State, instead of here in Cornwall and in SDSG. In British Columbia Premier Gordon Campbell resigned over HST outrage, and I hope voters give Dalton McGuinty what he deserves next October. Ironically, during a time when the Ontario government won’t show families mercy by taking HST off of hydro, the Ontario government has money in the purse to help foreign students. At a time when more and more students born and raised in Ontario graduate with OSAP debts and interest to pay on those loans; the government doesn’t have a nickle to help those student out, but has money for foreign students! According to the Toronto Sun: “Undergraduate university students in Ontario pay the highest tuition fees in the country. In 2010-11 Ontario students will pay $6,307 a year or about $1,500 more than B.C. tuition, $4,000 more than tuition in Newfoundland and Quebec, for example”. HST is driving more full time jobs out of Ontario, so now our graduates are even less likely to ever pay of their debts. I am not against taxes, just regressive ones that hurt poorer people and families and seniors and small businesses.
Listen carefully…the HST is to pay for that war we are running on a credit card. The HST didn’t exist prior to the WAR.
Aside from that Jason is correct. Educated people make more money, pay more taxes, start more business and fulfill healthy cycles. There are lots of arguments for zero tuition with the only requirement being to pass an entrance exam and maintain a standing. It is ironic that we have this discussion in a community with the highest illiteracy rate in Ontario. Our school board has carefully staged and managed a deliberate, controlled drop out rate of 50% for a generation. Kinda sinister, really. Result is the same as intention when dealing with groomed professionals.
I’m pleased that John Milnes likes the HST – of course, John likes anything RED!
Go peddle your story out in British Columbia, John, and see how many friends your HST stand makes you in a province that a few years ago was a have-not province, and is now only one of three have provinces – my province, Ontario is near bankruptcy….
Did they not hold a referenndum in BC to remove the HST?
Does anyone know if or how it worked out? Maybe we need to have one in Ontario as well.
Sharon, we cannot remove it, because McGuinty made a deal with the tax devil, Flaherty (who was the real brainchild of the HST to begin with) and now if we get it abolished, we have to pay back +4 billion to the feds that gave our province that money for implementing it (hence why the provincial cons haven’t promised to abolish it).. Nice of Joe Gunn to get on here and defend the “Blues” when really it is them that voted yes (even Lauzon voted yes as per against for sure 51% of his constituents on that) to allow it to be applied to the province of Ontario. Likewise Joe Gunn, go peddle your “Con” support elsewhere!
Benjamin Franklin, originally the income tax was applied to help pay for WW2. It was supposed to be abolished after that but of course, seeing the cash cow that our government was sucking in, they decided not to get rid of it.
The GST (which was applied by our previous PC Mulroney government) was to be abolished as a promise by Harper if he were voted into power. He proceeded to remove 2% from that. And then of course, suddenly, the HST came up to replace it. So Harper did indeed look like he did what he promised on that part. But if you think for one second that he didn’t know about Flaherty’s brainchild HST to be implemented, think again.. its easy to make promises to abolish something when you already know its going to be replaced with something even worse anyways, and then look no worse after the fact and trying to pawn it off on the Ontario Liberal provincial government afterwards!
At least the eco-fee’s were abolished, that was a step in the right direction on that part. We’ll see what happens down the road as for what benefits the HST may actually have, but I don’t hold my breath on any taxes anymore, I only end up paying them and watching our government’s at all levels squander them away after the fact, with little good happening for the people that pay the taxes in the first place!
We DO HOWEVER, need an impeachment process for politicians that lie through their teeth about what they are going to do!
I think you nailed it Grimalot. The way I understand it is that the Harper government has been lobbying and offering incentives to the provinces to adopt the HST. It was a stroke of tactical genius that will wipe out the provincial Liberals in BC and Ontario. I’ve yet to hear Hudak say that he will kill the HST when he becomes our premier.
I have sent many messages to Hudak, and not one response, it would be political suicide for him to go against the Fed Cons and abolish the HST they so want in place.. they managed to pull the wool over many eyes, and blame it on the Liberals, when they are the real puppet masters on this one.. and unfortunately, with some supporters, its like the blind leading the blind..
The Libs will be shot down in flames in the next election mainly because of the HST. Interesting that Hudak refuses to discuss the issue.
Furtz I’m not buying into that. I don’t think Ontario voters get as emotional as some others and are smart enough to realize that if not the HST there’d be some other tax.
Consumption taxes are the fairest and most efficient. Those that have the most pay the most, and generally can’t hide the way some can via corporate taxes.
Not sure that I agree Jamie. Income tax seems more fair because it’s based (in theory) on annual income. Someone bringing in 200G/yr pays a higher rate than someone bringing in 20G/yr. Consumption tax, especially on necessities like heating and hydro, hits poorer people really hard. From all the comments and letters I’ve been reading all over the province, it looks like the HST will sink the Libs, right or wrong. It certainly is the case in BC.
Furtz as long as write offs can come into play very well paid accountants find ways for their clients to pay as little tax as possible. I know far too many people that don’t pay their fair share of tax and they don’t do so by cheating either. It’s the way the system is set up.
The HST was also a perfect way for the “cons” to taunt the money grubbing bXXXXXX that mcguinty is and knowing he would immediately apply it along with all his other “not a tax” tax grabs, in turn would help the provincial Liberal party to commit suicide (along with how it helps drive down the fed libs because everyone ties both parties together) and now we’ll possibly end up with Hudak at the helm, who does nothing about it anyways.. except to use the issue to ride the coattails to power… and then who knows what other taxes we’ll have levied on us after.. I view the HST as a trap, both on the feds and also the provincial governments.. A trap by the feds because harper full well knew it would be implemented, so his promise to abolish the GST meant nothing.. and a trap on the Ontario Liberal party that applied it as well because of the political suicide.. smart moves indeed, but unfortunately, its the masses that got shafted! And then they go and defend the wrong party when really, it was their party (the cons) to begin with that dreamed it up in the first place..
Regardless, it is the fairest and most efficient tax indeed, just too bad it was applied to so many other items that really, it should have been left out of.. and it shouldn’t have been rolled out with all those eco-fees either, there’s another political suicide for the ontario libs..
Yes, it’s a shame that those 2% were taken from the GST for political gains leaving Canada with a larger deficit during a recession. Does that sound like good fiscal management? Nope.
nope, not good fiscal management at all, but again, I go back to my trap theory, this was all engineered long before it was put into very realistic and effective effect!
I totally agree that these loopholes in the income tax system, set up by our rulers for their wealthy friends, should be eliminated.
I offer for discussion that more tax dollars are not going to road systems; hospitals or medical services, snow ploughing in the winter months, and police services. We all know that extra revenue is going to the people working these positions. Annual wages and pensions are accounting for these increases.
We see this week how an arbitrator has bypasses the McGuinty optics of no increases to give Nurses more money. Nurses are the ones who do the work and we should be thankful for them, however, we can not afford to give everyone more! Tax saturation point are the words I should have used in my earler post.
Nothing will change untill the people speak out loudly! And often!
I think Cornwall has more to worry about than HST. Did you know that the fluoride in our water effects the brain, causes cancers,dental fluorosis in children, Gastrointestinal problems,Hypersensitivity. kidney problems, skeletal fluorosis, thyroid problems & increases blood lead levels? Did you know Hitler used fluoride in the water to dumb down the population? (basically couch potato effect). Did you know one of the main ingredients in the atom bomb was fluoride?
Maybe if we can get the fluoride out of our water in Cornwall, we might get more people out to vote, people who want to make a difference!
The City of Waterloo did when the won the Oct 25th referendum!
Don’t believe everything I say, research it yourself.
Start by visiting the Waterloo Watch website.
http://www.waterloowatch.com/health_effects.html
Lets get people off their butts and caring again!
We seem to pay a lot in tax dollars yet do not receive a comparable service in return. I think I can say people would not complain if they received the service we pay for.
Take a look at just one small portion of government expenditures in this case pension and health care privileges. I cannot recall what they all make and at what level but I can assure it is in the billions of dollars in pensions alone. These are services run by businesses unlike the general populous which are primarily a form of self directed.
Health care, I was in the hospital a couple days back and sat for over 6 hours waiting. I spoke with a another patient having come in shortly after me and the person could not feel the entire side of her body it was numb, there too was a young girl whose hand was stiff and unable to bend, when mom touched it or she tried to bend the pain was enough to tear her eyes. After waiting for over 6 hours I left out of frustration and these two people I met where still there waiting. I called the next day to see if the tests done the night before were sent to my Dr and the response I had was astounding, “ I am not sure but you can come in and speak to them but it will be a 12 hour wait”
Now really Mr Milnes do you think we as Canadians are getting an equal share of the taxation system or is it catering to the select few?
That is absolutely disgusting Sharon.