Cornwall Ontario City Councilor and Federal Liberal Candidate Bernadette Clement to Run for Council – September 3, 2010

Cornwall ON – Councillor Bernadette Clement today announced her intention to seek re-election to Cornwall City Council.
“In November of 2006, I was given the honour of the trust and confidence of my fellow citizens of Cornwall when they elected me as a Councillor of the City of Cornwall.  Since then I have worked hard to respect that trust and that confidence and to live up to my promise to bring a new voice, a new spirit and a new hope to City Council. I am happy to announce that I will be seeking re-election as a Councillor in the October 25th Municipal Election.”
Clement, who is also the federal Liberal candidate in the riding of Stormont-Dundas-South Glengarry, spoke of her deep commitment to public service.
“I wish to serve.” she said.  I want to contribute to making the right decisions for Cornwall on its path to the future. I want to continue to pitch in because service to our community matters   ” With a minority Parliament situation in Ottawa, the timing of the next federal election is uncertain. “There may in fact be no such election for a year or more from now. If I am re-elected to City Council, I will take a leave of absence during the Federal campaign period and would step down from City Council if I am elected to Federal office.”
Until that time, Clement said it’s important to her to continue her tradition of public service.
“I accepted the Federal Liberal nomination because it is my belief that there are major issues confronting our area which must be dealt with at that level.” she continued. “I am seeking re-election municipally because I want to do what I can right now to make the City I love an even better place for us all.”

“Progress in economic development and social development won’t happen by itself” she added. “It takes vision and wisdom to decide where we want to go, long-term planning to know how to get there, and courage to get going.”

“This is what we must do with our precious waterfront. We need to protect it and improve it for all our citizens and visitors to enjoy. This is the work we began with the splash pad and washroom in Lamoureux Park. We finally went from talking about things to actually making them happen. Now we need to get on with the job.

We also need to continue to be able to say proudly that we are a responsible and caring community. The significant contributions from the City to the Hospice, the Boys and Girls Club and to the Agape Centre have been part of that.

As we redefine ourselves as a community we must also make sure that our city remains a healthy community, with protecting our environment as part of our legacy. We need to reach out to the creative talent of our local artists, to the wisdom of our seniors, to the energy and idealism of our young persons.

“I have worked hard to bring sound judgment and the values of compassion, justice and respect to the Council table. I believe I have helped to set a proper tone for our work. There is so much potential here. But it is important to bring people together to make the right things happen” she concluded.

41 Responses to "Cornwall Ontario City Councilor and Federal Liberal Candidate Bernadette Clement to Run for Council – September 3, 2010"

  1. GelatinousMutantCoconut   September 3, 2010 at 1:43 PM

    It makes sense. This is very good news. We certainly need her sound voice of reason at the Council Table. Hopefully her and Elaine MacDonald can be joined by some like-minded new councillors.

  2. smee   September 4, 2010 at 7:08 AM

    I was wondering if Bernadette would support a long time liberal initiative spoken to Canadians in 1907 bt Wilfred Laurier on immigration. This could help solve a huge expenditure issue.

    ‘In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes a Canadian and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the person’s becoming in every facet a Canadian, and nothing but a Canadian…There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is a Canadian, but something else also, isn’t an Canadian at all. We have room for but one flag, the Canadian flag… We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language.. And we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the Canadian people.’

    Wilfrid Laurier 1907

  3. vin   September 4, 2010 at 9:00 AM

    Canada has two official languages: English and French.

  4. smee   September 4, 2010 at 10:11 AM

    Vin
    Not in all provnces. You still seem to miss the point of the post

  5. Cornwall Harry   September 4, 2010 at 3:34 PM

    Congratulations to Bernadette for making the right decision and not running with a bunch of losers.

  6. Furtz   September 4, 2010 at 3:54 PM

    Canada has two official Languages: English and French. Our immigration rules and regulations have nothing to do with provincial laws. Some people have difficulty differentiating between provincial and federal jurisdictions and laws.

  7. willie191   September 4, 2010 at 5:29 PM

    What has she done for Cornwall?

  8. vin   September 5, 2010 at 1:11 PM

    I’m sorry, I wasn’t specific enough… Canada has 2 official languages at the federal level BOTH English and French.

    English and French have equal status in federal courts, Parliament, and in all federal institutions.

    That’s all I have to say. Think what you want to think.

  9. bobgeneric   September 5, 2010 at 7:12 PM

    Smee, I have asked over and over again of the posters or letter to the editor authors that have demanded immigrants become “Canadians” or assimilate to “Canadian Culture” and so I ask this of you as well; please post the list of the rules for new immigrants so they can assimilate smoothly into Canadian culture.
    `
    I extent this challenge to anyone to post the assimilation rules of which “new immigrants” are to adhere to, since this is tied in with culture, a list of the clothing and allowable religions as well. Just to help you along, we should take a look at what makes up this county and look at the Canadian citizens that live here;
    In Canada there are 300,000 Muslim, 400,000 Hindus, 3,000,000 are vegetarians, 3,000,000 Asians, 2,000,000 indigenous peoples, 166,000 Mormons, over 1,000,000 Jehovah Witness, 70,000 wiccans (witches) etc etc etc……is there a picture of Canada forming in your head yet?
    Exactly what is a Canadian?
    ~
    Lastly, I would like to address your quote of Sir Wilfred Laurier. Canada is a multi-cultural society not a melting pot of assimilation as it is south of the border.
    So it should come as no surprise to you or anyone that the words you quoted did not come from Sir Wilfrid Laurier but from the Former President of the US Theodore Roosevelt and not 1907 but 1917.
    ~
    I think if someone is going to perpetuate intolerance towards immigrants they should at least get their facts straight.
    ~
    http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/troosevelt.asp
    http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl_roosevelt_on_immigrants.htm

  10. Furtz   September 5, 2010 at 7:58 PM

    Now don’t be so hard on Smee, bobgeneric. It’s not important who originally came up with that BS. It fits with Smee’s ideology and that’s all that matters. Also, you neglected to mention the large Pastafarian segment of our society. What are we, chopped liver?

  11. vin   September 5, 2010 at 8:58 PM

    Smee, I beleive it is you that missed the point of my post. I was only getting the fact straight about our nation’s languages (which was stated wrong).

  12. bobgeneric   September 5, 2010 at 10:55 PM

    Furtz said, “Also, you neglected to mention the large Pastafarian segment of our society. What are we, chopped liver?”
    ~
    Sorry Furtz I didn’t mention your group. But to clarify there are only a very small number of Pastafarians as they are a small breakaway sect (no stats availible) of the larger group of Spagittifarians of which there are 10,000 give or take.

  13. tnpreacher555   September 6, 2010 at 6:30 AM

    Lax immigration laws is the Liberal way of buying votes. With Canada’s low birth rate, population growth must be supplemented with imagination. It is only a matter of time for Canada to become a Muslim state just by the increase in population. It is not so much what we are, it is what we are becoming!

  14. Antipasta   September 6, 2010 at 10:21 AM

    Pastor Tom, you wouldn’t let that happen would you?

  15. The Watcher   September 6, 2010 at 10:59 AM

    The problem is not Muslim immigration per se, but the influx of fundamentalists with their high birth rate and their zero tolerance for others.

    This problem is not confined to Islamic fundamentalists, but also Jewish fundamentalists, Hindu fundamentalists, Sikh fundamentalists, Buddist fundamentalists, Pastafarian fundamentalists, and, dare I say it, the self-styled “Christian” fundamentalists.

    My apologies if I left any group out.

  16. tnpreacher555   September 6, 2010 at 2:40 PM

    Watcher says -“the influx of fundamentalists with their high birth rate and their zero tolerance for others” So Watcher, you must be a Muslim! You would love a Muslim Canada controlled by Sharia law? At lease Christians believe in working in the frame work of democracy, while Islam will not tolerate democracy, nor human rights. This is not just a slam on Islam – world demographics prove that such is the case. Look at any Islamic controlled country – the hard cold facts speaks for themselves.

  17. Furtz   September 6, 2010 at 3:36 PM

    Hey Watcher, There’s no such thing as a fundamentalist Pastsfarian. All we ask for is beer and spaghetti, and we would never force these things on other people. That would be stupid as it would leave less for us.

  18. Eric   September 6, 2010 at 4:18 PM

    No matter if Laurier or Roosevelt said it, I would think it would represent a time where people looked after themselves and thier country. No special headwear for the RCMP (NWMP), no dual citizenship, one main language for worldwide business dealings, and fewer government programs eating at our wallets. Merit to get a job not skin colour even.

    Should something like the States though be put in our laws, the one where you need to be born in the country to become top leader?

    I know it is legal, but is a leave of absense during a federal election campaign still providing a city salary during that? Who speaks for the voters in your area then?

  19. bobgeneric   September 7, 2010 at 1:12 AM

    You may think that Eric, but maybe you should view it in the context of the time in history that it was said.
    `
    Although the Blacks had been freed from slavery they were still discriminated against, oppressed by racial laws. It would be 50 years before the Jim Crow Laws would be repealed and illiterate people in the south (at that time mostly black) would be able to vote.
    The Chinese where the new slaves, as they built the railroads with no labour protection, as did any labourer in any factory.
    It would not be any more than 25 years after this speech was made that both the US and Canada would round up their citizens of Japanese descent and push them all into fenced internment camps relieving them of their property and wealth.
    It would be 3 years after this that women were successful in gaining the same equality as white men with the passing of the Nineteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, which provided: “The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any state on account of sex.”and got the right to vote.
    In Canda it was the start of several decades where it was illegal for a Native to hire a lawyer and go to court to fight for their land, allowing the wholesale theft of vast tracks of agricultural land to be stolen by white squatters under the rule (that still exists today) that once a non Native erected a structure on native land then a claim could not be made to get it back.
    In the states they would still be decades off from passing laws to allow Chinese and other Asians to become citizens (basically until that happened they were just immigrant slaves)
    I could fill this page with more examples but why we all know and study our histories right?
    ~
    It was a time if your skin was not white you were not equal, no matter what Roosevelt believed or said as it was not practised by very many.

  20. bobgeneric   September 7, 2010 at 1:31 AM

    Tom said, “You would love a Muslim Canada controlled by Sharia law? At lease Christians believe in working in the frame work of democracy, while Islam will not tolerate democracy, nor human rights. This is not just a slam on Islam – world demographics prove that such is the case. Look at any Islamic controlled country – the hard cold facts speaks for themselves.”
    ~
    Tom do you ever tire of your own inane BS?
    You are proposing that once we have enough Muslims in Canada they will take over and we will all be controlled by Sharia Law. Now you contend that the “hard cold facts speaks for themselves”.
    Okay so here are some cold hard facts.
    ~
    What about Turkey Tom?
    74 million people, 99% Muslim and Turkey is a parliamentary representative democracy. Since its foundation as a republic in 1923, Turkey has developed a strong tradition of secularism. Turkey’s constitution governs the legal framework of the country. It sets out the main principles of government and establishes Turkey as a unitary centralized state.
    ~
    What would Jesus say about you preaching intolerance through hyperbole?

  21. Furtz   September 7, 2010 at 4:11 AM

    Hey Tom, Will you be joining in with Pastor Terry Jones on September 11th for the big Koran burning party?
    Should be fun.
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/americas/us-preachers-plan-to-burn-koran-inflames-muslims/article1697677/

  22. Eric   September 7, 2010 at 5:57 AM

    Interesting food for thought bobgeneric, I have always enjoyed history, not the stuff being taught today. I have a young family member who on Canada Day this year, told me Ottawa was chosen as the nations capital because it was halfway between Toronto and Montreal. I always thought it had more to do with 1812 and 1837, and it is not halfway between.

    We still have traditions that are less than equal to all society members, you can’t drive legally till 16, you can’t own property til 18, smoking and drinking at 19. Kids are forced to stay to in school til at least 16. I still believe this time, when looked at in the future, will not be as kind to present multiculturism.

    And how can you be sure that if Muslims in the future were in the majority, they would not push their beliefs on others? The past may present possibilities, but are no guarentee of future outcomes.

  23. tnpreacher555   September 7, 2010 at 6:02 AM

    No – Furtz, I won’t be joining Pastor Terry Jones. The Bible says –

    “(For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;) Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled” (2 Corinthians 10:4-6).

    “Carnal” weapons would be like using politics, legislating morality, marketing techniques, worldly psychology, and theatrics, like burning the horrid Koran to influence others. Such who promote and use such ways are missing the true Biblical method –

    ” For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe” (1 Corinthians 1:17-18,21).

    By the foolishness of preaching against error by the truth of the Word of God, sinners are brought to the Light of the Truth: the Lord Jesus Christ. This is how the Lord Jesus did it, the Apostles, the early church, and so should we.

  24. tnpreacher555   September 7, 2010 at 6:22 AM

    bobgeneric: As soon as you see the coalition forces pull out of that area – watch Islam gain back its strength! And for some cold hard facts – look how Islam is taking over Europe! Leaders of Islamic countries are saying that they don’t need to send in the terrorists into Europe, just by increase in population via immigration Muslims will take over in a few years, and Europe will become a Muslim state. Open your eyes, if you will, the same is happening here in Canada!

    The one thing that a lot, or most Westerners do not see – Muslims are commanded by the Koran to force all to submit unto the yoke of Islam. Western culture Muslims are working towards that end also, but in a more deceptive way. Islam has declared a Holy War upon the West, and it will not stop until all are brought under its yoke – by peaceful means (immigration), or by the Sword.

  25. Furtz   September 7, 2010 at 5:35 PM

    Actually Tom, it’s probably smart of you to express your hatred in a low-key way. Your Christian bro, Pastor Terry Jones, carries a big gun in case of trouble. Still, using terms like “the horrid Koran” is probably not a wise habit to continue. You’ve pretty much insulted everybody, religious or not, in our community, and that is really a stupid thing to do. Lots of religious people take these insults seriously.

  26. bobgeneric   September 7, 2010 at 7:06 PM

    Tom you preach fear and hyperbole.
    Although I agree that Afghanistan is a country controlled by Fanatical Muslims that have hijacked a religion to perpetuate a climate of terror and violence, there are just as many off shoots and sects in the Muslim religion as there are in Christianity.
    ~
    To paint all 1.3 billion Muslims with the brush of violence for the acts of the comparatively few fanatical Muslim sects would be the same as me judging all Christians by insisting you are all as dangerous and violent as the Branch Dividians or Jim Jones followers.
    ~
    It would be pretty easy for me to regard your Church as nothing more than affiliates of the “ARMY OF GOD” who perpetuate and practice Terrorism on abortion clinics, doctors and their patients, considering your question to Ms. Milner the other day of “Are you pro life or pro abortion?”.
    Come on Tom you know it is Pro Choice.
    ~
    Have you ever read the Quran? How about just the actual verses and passages that the fear mongers often misquote?
    Do you know any Muslims? I have worked along side a few and I used to live next a Muslim Neighborhood so I am basing my opinions on what I have experienced. I have read parts of the Quran so that I may come to my own conclusions about Muslims and what their Holy Book actually says. You should too!
    ~
    Islam is not taking over Europe, you have drank the koolade of Islamaphobia.
    ~
    “Slightly more than 4 percent of Europe’s population is Muslim, as defined by demographers (though about 80 per cent of these people are not religiously observant, so they are better defined as secular citizens who have escaped religious nations). It is possible, though not certain, that this number could rise to 6 percent by 2020. If current immigration and birth rates remain the same, it could even rise to 10 percent within 100 years. But it won’t, because Muslims don’t actually have more babies than other populations do under the same circumstances. The declining population growth rates are not confined to native populations. In fact, immigrants from Muslim countries are experiencing a faster drop in reproduction rates than the larger European population.”
    —Doug Sanders—-Globe and Mail
    ~
    I suggest you educate yourself and not just repeat the fear and misconceptions that the few ignorant and intolerant have been successfully spreading.
    You should start here:

    http://www.caircan.ca/aboutus.php
    http://www.muslimcanadiancongress.org/whoweare.html
    http://www.alislam.org/quran/

  27. tnpreacher555   September 7, 2010 at 7:25 PM

    “Lots of religious people take these insults seriously”. – God takes very serious all the insults that these religious ones say against His Son – Messiah Jesus

    The Resurrected Son of God said this -“For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel. For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him”. (John 5:20-23).

    So these religious ones say they honor God, but they do not honor the Son as it is written in His Holy Word. He is the Messiah, the Son of God, the Only Savior given to mankind. Such religious ones reject Christ’s deity, His atonement, and His literal resurrection. We should be concern about offending God, rather than man!

    “I am come in my Father’s name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? “(Joh 5:43-44)

  28. tnpreacher555   September 7, 2010 at 7:33 PM

    bobgeneric, Look who is throwing mud now? A little bit below your dignity? Thanks, but no thanks, I have better things to do with my time than to sit at the feet of a Muslim, specially when I can sit at the feet of the Lord Jesus Christ!

    Joh 8:24 “I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins”.

  29. Standup   September 7, 2010 at 7:42 PM

    And one of the scribes came and heard them arguing, and recognizing that He had answered them well, asked Him, “What commandment is the foremost of all?” Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God is one Lord; and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ “The second is this, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” ( Mark 12:28-31)

    “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” (John 13:34-35)

    “There is a saying, ‘Love your friends and hate your enemies.’ But I say: Love your enemies! Pray for those who persecute you! In that way you will be acting as true sons of your Father in heaven. For he gives his sunlight to both the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust too. If you love only those who love you, what good is that? Even scoundrels do that much. If you are friendly only to your friends, how are you different from anyone else? Even the heathen do that. But you are to be perfect, even as your Father in heaven is perfect. (Matthew 5:43-48)

    I have Muslim neighbors too and they are fine and considerate people who act very…neighborly.

  30. tnpreacher555   September 7, 2010 at 7:56 PM

    Standup: all the verses you wrote are correct and great, but Muslims do not love the Lord Jesus Christ! Ask a Muslim:Is Jesus Lord and Messiah? Ask any Muslim: Have they trusted the Lord Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of their sins? They will say that God never had a Son, and the prophet Jesus never died on the cross! And by obeying the Koran, they will get to paradise! Save your Bible verses for your Muslim neighbors. Of course they will reject your Book too! By the way, Standup – Does the Bible teach that a person can save themselves by religious works? – [go ask Saul, the Apostle Paul – Phil. 3].

    1Co 16:22 “If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha”. To really love the Lord Jesus, you must believe everything He said he was, and you must accept all that He came to do. [1Co 16:22 If anyone does not love the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed. The Lord comes!].

  31. Furtz   September 7, 2010 at 8:07 PM

    Tom, I really don’t give a rats ass what happens to you. I’m just saying that if you continue insulting people, religious or otherwise, you will eventually wish that you hadn’t. It’s just a fact of life that you don’t seem to be aware of. Thankfully for you no nut-case fundamentalist has come after you. It’s one thing to preach intolerance and hate to a few like minded folks in your own church, but it’s complete insanity to do it in public.

  32. Grimalot   September 7, 2010 at 10:10 PM

    I’m with The Watcher on all this…

    pastor tom, as usual, you’re an idiot, glad to see I haven’t missed anything.. first of all, read what people post if you want to make a comment on anything, The Watcher has it very much right…

    oddly enough, I agree with bobgeneric in many ways.. but I wont get into it now..

    And Standup, awesome 😀 Always love someone quoting scripture to counteract the dribble that the pastor writes… And I know very many super respectful Muslims as well, some of the best people I know.. not all Muslims are of the fundamentalist or fanatic type..

    pastor, I still say you lead more of a cult than any seriously organized religion, its easy to get the pastor badge and preach, but you are still very much a very fine line from hate speech.. And I can only hope that with your latest spewings, that Mr. Vakily doesn’t receive any further threat’s…

  33. smee   September 8, 2010 at 4:13 PM

    and after all this, is Bernadette running for ocuncil because she knows she has no chance at the MP position, or is it a form of job security as a politician.

  34. Furtz   September 8, 2010 at 6:07 PM

    Smee, Put that bottle away.

  35. tnpreacher555   September 8, 2010 at 8:33 PM

    I see Standup has failed to reply. I wonder why?

  36. smee   September 8, 2010 at 8:51 PM

    Furtz, why do you have such a difficult time with reality?

  37. Standup   September 9, 2010 at 6:10 AM

    Sorry Pastor Bob,
    I didn’t reply because I was a bit busy with other things. Sorry, I can’t be on the computer all day.

    It is true what you say that people of different faiths do not see Jesus as their savior. However, Jesus did not say love only those who love me.
    In fact his command was…

    “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” (John 13:34-35)

    As I have loved you not just who loves me.
    When Jesus spoke about who our neighbors are he didn’t say just the people who live near us or just the people who follow our faith but all people as exemplified in one of his most famous parables.

    One day an expert on Moses’ laws came to test Jesus’ orthodoxy by asking him this question: “Teacher, what does a man need to do to live forever in heaven?” Jesus replied, “What does Moses’ law say about it?” “It says,” he replied, “that you must love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your strength, and with all your mind. And you must love your neighbor just as much as you love yourself.” “Right!” Jesus told him. “Do this and you shall live!” The man wanted to justify (his lack of love for some kinds of people), so he asked, “Which neighbors?” Jesus replied with an illustration: “A Jew going on a trip from Jerusalem to Jericho was attacked by bandits. They stripped him of his clothes and money, and beat him up and left him lying half dead beside the road. “By chance a Jewish priest came along; and when he saw the man lying there, he crossed to the other side of the road and passed him by. A Jewish Temple-assistant walked over and looked at him lying there, but then went on. “But a despised Samaritan came along, and when he saw him, he felt deep pity. Kneeling beside him the Samaritan soothed his wounds with medicine and bandaged them. Then he put the man on his donkey and walked along beside him till they came to an inn, where he nursed him through the night. The next day he handed the innkeeper two twenty-dollar bills and told him to take care of the man. ‘If his bill runs higher than that,’ he said, ‘I’ll pay the difference the next time I am here.’ “Now which of these three would you say was a neighbor to the bandits’ victim?” The man replied, “The one who showed him some pity.” Then Jesus said, “Yes, now go and do the same.” (Luke 10:25-37)

    Samaritans if you recall were enemies of the Jewish people and did not believe in the same things that they did.

    Jesus went so far as to ask us to love our enemies.

    “But I say to you that listen, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you. If anyone strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also; and from anyone who takes away your coat do not withhold even your shirt. Give to everyone who begs from you; and if anyone takes away your goods, do not ask for them again. Do to others as you would have them do to you. “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners love those who love them. If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same. If you lend to those from whom you hope to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, to receive as much again. But love your enemies, do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return. Your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High; for he is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked. Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. “Do not judge, and you will not be judged; do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven; give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together, running over, will be put into your lap; for the measure you give will be the measure you get back.” (Luke 6 27-38)

    You are correct Bob the bible does teach us that we will be saved by religious works but Jesus also taught us that we will be saved by the good work that we do unto others.

    “But when the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then he will sit on the throne of his glory. Before him all the nations will be gathered, and he will separate them one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. Then the King will tell those on his right hand, ‘Come, blessed of my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; for I was hungry, and you gave me food to eat. I was thirsty, and you gave me drink. I was a stranger, and you took me in. I was naked, and you clothed me. I was sick, and you visited me. I was in prison, and you came to me.’

    “Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry, and feed you; or thirsty, and give you a drink? 38When did we see you as a stranger, and take you in; or naked, and clothe you? When did we see you sick, or in prison, and come to you?’

    “The King will answer them, ‘Most certainly I tell you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’ Then he will say also to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry, and you didn’t give me food to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me no drink; I was a stranger, and you didn’t take me in; naked, and you didn’t clothe me; sick, and in prison, and you didn’t visit me.’

    “Then they will also answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and didn’t help you?’

    “Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Most certainly I tell you, inasmuch as you didn’t do it to one of the least of these, you didn’t do it to me.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” (Mathew 25 31-46)

    I hate to insinuate that people of other faiths are considered the least of these and that is not my intention but the point is that Jesus told us to show love for all.

    You quoted Paul who you will also remember once persecuted Christians and yet found forgiveness.
    I also like this quote from Corinthians.

    If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
    Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. (Corinthians 1 13:1-7)

    You asked me to share this with my Muslim neighbors. We have had some discussions on faith in a peaceful discourse and do you know what they say when I mention Jesus? “Blessings be upon his name.” In short, respect. True they do not believe as I do but who am I to judge them or treat them with disrespect?
    I am not going to continue slinging quotes back and forth though Bob since you appear to remain entrenched in your views and choose to condemn others beliefs which is evidenced in your reference to the “horrid” Koran.

  38. Grimalot   September 9, 2010 at 7:25 AM

    Now that’s a Standup comment from Standup. 😉 Standup, do you mean that comment for pastor tom by the way?

  39. tnpreacher555   September 9, 2010 at 7:36 AM

    First thing my name is Tom. Standup I can see by your religious statements that you are the average, run of the mill, religious compromiser.

    False statement #1 -“You are correct Bob the bible does teach us that we will be saved by religious works but Jesus also taught us that we will be saved by the good work that we do unto others”. Roman Catholics, Mormons, Jehovah Witness, and Seven Adventist might believe your statement, but such is not taught in the Holy Word of God. It is never Christ + your works that saves! Good works are the evidence that I have been “born of God”. Good works is the fruit of being vitally joined to the Living Head, as the Vine and the branches. Here are clear statements from the Holy Bible that salvation is completely by grace through faith alone:

    Galatians 2:16,21 “Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain”.

    Romans 3:20 “Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin”. Titus 3:5 “Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost”.

    Ephesians 2:8-10 “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them”. Side note: James 2 does not teach “faith + works” saves. That is a Roman Catholic perversion of that text. James is teaching that works justify our faith – whether our faith is genuine, or counterfeit.

    False statement #2:”You asked me to share this with my Muslim neighbors. We have had some discussions on faith in a peaceful discourse and do you know what they say when I mention Jesus? “Blessings be upon his name.” In short, respect. True they do not believe as I do but who am I to judge them or treat them with disrespect?

    Muslims acknowledge the Lord Jesus Christ as a prophet. In their Koran, they are commanded that they are to reverence all of God’s prophets [Sura 3:2-3,49]. But the Islamic formula -(p. b.u.h.) falls far, far short of the glory and honour ascribed to the Son of God via the inspired Word of God.

    The Bible is very clear on the exalted place that God has given His Son for His voluntary death on the cross. Philippians 2:9-11 “Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father”. One can not honor God aright unless one honors the Son equally[same manner] – John 5:23 “That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him”.

    For a Muslim, as you wrote -“It is true what you say that people of different faiths do not see Jesus as their savior”. It is not a matter of how “people of different faiths’ see it, it is what God has declared that matters. Note:

    John 10:9 “I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture”. John14:6 “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me”. 1 Timothy 2:5 “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus”.Hebrews 10:18-21 “Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. 19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, 20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; 21 And having an high priest over the house of God”. Acts 4:12 ‘Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved”.

    Since Muslims fail to give the Lord Jesus Christ His rightful place and due, the Lord God Almighty rejects Islam in total. Finally the Lord Jesus says this to all: John 8:24 “I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins”.

  40. Standup   September 10, 2010 at 7:32 AM

    First off,
    I am sorry for getting your name wrong. I am not sure why I did that but it was an honest mistake. I apologize for that.
    Pastor Tom you call me a religious compromiser. Guilty as charged.
    In my mind we could use a whole lot more compromising in this world to prevent people from turning to violence and aggression in the name of religion. Terry Jones seemed to see that as he has backed off on his controversial plan to incite more violence with his plans to burn the Koran. I applaud that he also plans to meet with the Iman of the controversial New York mosque to express his concerns about their building on ground zero. Dare I say it? I hope that they can meet a compromise.
    I was naively hoping we could find a common ground. I see we have none. We have both read the same text but interpret it very differently. I am sure you will respond to this post and I will let you have the last word on the subject but I have made my stand and I have made my point. I do not need to elaborate more than that and I won’t be responding.

  41. tnpreacher555   September 10, 2010 at 8:49 AM

    Standup: I accept your apology.

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