CFN – While new Quebec Premier opened ugly sides of racism and linguistic hate in the last election that saw her gain a minority victory questions have to be asked “What of Stephen Harper’s Quebec strategy?”
And there is one. Our Prime Minister is primarily known as a Politician of Strategy. There’s not much hidden. Not too many surprises. It’s a grinding machine that rolls around or over on its way to its targets.
We’ve already seen the media shift hard to the right since his first election victory and so far barring a really really really embarrassing scandal (not Bev Oda embarrassing) we most likely will see another Harper Government next election.
What was kinda sorta interesting about the last Federal election was that Mr. Harper seemed to walk far away from Quebec; almost encouraging Thomas Mulcair’s NDP to beat up the Grits and grind the party he has such a hate on for.
Now what? Across Canada we’re seeing a huge backlash against official bilingualism and in many instances for justifiable reasons. It’s not anti-French so much as the reality of do we really need Supreme Court Justices to be highly bilingual? Military officers? All Federal employees?
There are two Canada’s in many senses. Canada and Quebec. Quebec has clearly voted for the Federalist option, but still acts like a dilettante.
For many in the ROC Quebec not only is not a good partner, but the amount of people that would like Quebec to leave Canada is seeing record support.
Driving over the Canadian flag while Ms Marois calls for a vote to remove the Canadian flag is a huge optic. Certainly those of us to whom being a proud Canadian means something are not terribly impressed; and of course most Canadians realize that it’s not the opinion of most Quebecers, but the issue is that there are no repercussions or accountability.
Bus attendants in Montreal pull stunts, paramedics refuse to speak English while attending a sick child; all are instances that should warrant people’s immediate dismissal as it surely would if someone did this to a Francophone in say…Saskatchewan.
Again, no voices of condemnation from Francophone institutions. No accountability.
Canada under Mr. Harper has shifted its economy to resources. The Tar Sands; etc and Northern Quebec sits on huge reserves.
Northern Quebec though if the province separated would be under contestation. After all it was not originally part of Quebec or lower Canada. And if can Quebec can separate from Canada then surely parts of the province may also be severed.
And that’s where strategy comes into place. Quebec has clearly rejected Mr. Harper and his style of politics as have other parts of Canada. Ultimately though Mr. Harper has isolated the province and as linguistic issues grow the pressure from within and without the Province will increase.
Interesting huh? The bigger picture always is. And there are tons of resources at stake. Billions and billions of dollars that would fall under Federal control rather than Quebec provincial control.
It’s a high stakes game of power politics that will change the world.
And imagine, all over having flags wave or stomped on. All over intolerance and injustice.
The not withstanding clause may in the end doom Quebec because there will be very little excuse for failure when Quebec becomes its own little island in a North American sea.
What do you think Canadians and Nation of Quebecers? Should Quebec play ball and sign the charter become a good Canadian province even if it hurts the protection of the French language in the province?
Is it all a done deal? Do you care about whether Quebec stays or goes and if Quebec stays should the Federal government do its job and protect English speakers in la belle Province?
You can post your comments below.
(Comments and opinions of Editorials, Letters to the Editor, and comments from readers are purely their own and don’t necessarily reflect those of the owners of this site, their staff, or sponsors.)
What is pointedly clear is that something needs to change. What that is, is indeed open for debate. But the rest of Canada cannot continue to tip-toe around Quebec’s increasingly strange pleas. I mean, just look at the above video that our moderator has posted about the flag being desecrated.
Now, try to think of this situation as a comparison. Would we ever see private citizens in ANY of the states of the American union desecrate their country’s flag out of reasons of Nationalistic policies? Would ANY of the states within the union ever elect a state government that openly admits to trying to separate the nation?
The answer to the above questions are no, we would never see this in the United States of America. For all of America’s faults, she cannot claim to be divisive amongst her peoples. That much is sure. An American is an American is an American. You will rarely hear an American citizen describe themselves as being a Franco American, Irish American or Mexican American.
I wish some of that common sense prevailed on our side of the border.
You are failing to make the distinction between individual bilingualism and institutional bilingualism. I have no problem whatsoever with people learning as many languages as they wish. I do not, however, wish for my government to work in more than one language, nor do I wish for it to be a pre-requisite in Québec to be bilingual before you can “move up” in society. Many Swedes, for example, speak several languages, notably English, but that does not mean that Sweden needs to be a multi-lingual State.
As for Canada having two national languages, that is the federal government’s business. On the federal level, there are two official languages, but all provinces save for New Brunswick is officially monolingual. Quebec is both a province and a distinct nation whose official and national language is French and none other. There are certain accommodations made with the intention of serving our historic Anglophone minority, but further than that it is not our duty to “bilingualize” our institutions, or to force bilingualism on our population or immigrants. The duty and raison d’être of the Quebec State is to personify the Quebec people and to govern according to its collective priorities and aspirations, while at the same time protecting certain inalienable rights of individuals, notably minorities. It just so happens that the language of the Quebec people is French (see the Charter of the French Language) and that getting a post-secondary education in English is not a an inalienable right, even less so when one does not belling to the aforementioned historic Anglophone minority.
In other words, speak any language you want, but the government speaks French and the language of work and instruction is also French. These principles are not in conflict with the Canadian constitution. The Supreme Court has said so.
I am surprised there is very little talk about Quebec population trends and how it affects the separatist agenda.
In particular Quebec’s population, like in many Canadian provinces, continues to grow only because of immigration since its total fertility rate is not self sustaining.
As such I have always wondered, on average, what new immigrant’s views on separation are and how those views are affected over time. Initially I would have thought new immigrants:
a) Have a closer attachment to the nation they immigrated to than to the province within that nation
b) Are more concerned about the economy and their job prospects than the cultural and historic underpinnings of the sovereignty movement
As such, at least initially, I would think they would tend to oppose separation. But does that change over time and if so how long does that change of view usually take?
Of course if it did not change over time, then time it self is against the separatists and the longer they fail to receive a clear mandate from the citizenry the harder it will be to get a clear mandate.
Perhaps it is an idea for a future CFN article? Or perhaps I just like the idea that in the end Canada will be kept together by the aspirations of new immigrants. There is something very Canadian in that I believe.
Stop obfuscating – QUEBEC wants QUEBEC out of CANADA!!!
If I may quote Abraham Lincoln who said that a NATION divided itself could not stand. I heartily agree that Kebec must go, it is only a question of time and territory. One quarter of the present land mass of Kebec, is all that they can lay any real claim to, and to be fair let them take it and go. Only so long as the route to the Maritime provinces is totally within Canada’s boundaries.
A conversation without all of the emotion needs to take place. Not an 8 year make work project like the B & B Commission of the 60’s.
We need to remove the current path of government employees being allowed to work and be supervised in the language of their choice. We need to drastically reduce the amounts of money given for advancement of one language.
I am not ready to give up on Quebec, they should be following the same rules as everybody else though.
It would be much better for Quebec to separate and lets get this over with. The province wouldn’t suddenly be severed off and surrounded by a moat or a Great Wall. Life would go on and business would be quite normal. The big problem is Quebec has a lot of the big ticket items like Armouries, Revenue Canada, Museums, Penitentiaries, Archives and control of the St.Lawrence
to mention but a few. How the heck they were given control over some of these major instituions in the first place is not really a mystery anymore. It’s time to take them back, abandon mandatory bilingualism and provide jobs for Canadians in the ROC.
All of the above is true,Steven Harper is doing the right thing by not giving any more perks to Quebec.
if you get rid of Quebec, you also get rid of Newfoundland and the Maritimes. Maybe that’s the bigger objective.
And if you really want to get rid of Quebec, you better make sure they have no land access to the U.S.
Overall, it doesn’t seem like a good idea. French is all but dead anyways so it can only get better. Can’t be fun seeing your language die. You don’t have to cave but you could cut them a bit of slack.
How about making all tv channels in Canada available to all Canadians. There must be English language tv in Quebec. Right?
I hear a lot of talk, but no action. I am talking about legal action, boycotts, trade embargoes, etc. Wake up Canada, Quebec only wants to be sovereign! She wants all of Canada to cater to her, and to her alone! As long as we bend over backwards to please our neighbor to the east, the more she will grab, the more she will demand!
Where is one’s honour? Quebec declares that such is the case because of her honour, because of her desire to preserve her culture. So, Canadians, it’s time to stop talking, and either force Quebec to be Canadian, or boot her out! Or as so often the case, as history is our witness, let us lie down and be walked upon again, and again, even as they did to our flag! Honour? Do we know what that is today?
Hello? Have you ever heard of the US Civil War, lol? Yes we Canadians do things differently than your beloved US. And thank goodness for that.
I would like to see the Charter Of french and Immigrant Rights and Freedoms gone with Quebec. I’m sure they’ll be nice and talk to me in English when they are shown tourist dollars. See what I did there? Son.
Harper would be the last to want to see Quebec separate! That said, he’s not one to allow himself to be dragged into the usual petty games played on that front.
Indeed, since Harper became PM there has been less turmoil and/or controversy between the federal government and Quebec than I can remember for the best part of four decades! This is, IMHO, essentially because Harper believes in the separation of federal and provincial jurisdictions as delineated by the BNA. He, unlike pretty much all of his predecessors, is not one to preach to Quebec on how to manage their own affairs, nor does this government go out of its way to meddle in them, nor for that matter, those of any other province.
Indeed, there is nothing the PQ would love more than for Harper to do exactly that, so that they could then cast him, Ottawa and the rest of the federation as trying to undermine Quebec’s culture and roll in Canada.
Just because PM Harper doesn’t indulge the same old, same old Liberal past nonsense with regard to Quebec, does not in any way mean that he is somehow disinterested in their future in Canada!
John Macdonald – don’t be such an extremist! Who said anything about war? Oh, I can hear it now -“we Canadians, we waited for our independence”. And we still have taxation without representation, don’t we? At lease men and woman, boys and girls were willing to stand up, and even die for principles, convictions, and the American ideal. Is that not what the Canadian arm forces did for this country in the great wars? Oh, for men with courage, fortitude, and yes, a back bone! Who will step up to the plate – Liberal leadership hopeful Justin Trudeau? :>(
“Yes we Canadians do things differently than your beloved US’- so what will we do, anything at all – complain, murmur, talk, talk, ….
Just for the record I am a Canadian citizen. I took an oath to up hold the laws of the land, and, Yes God save the Queen!
I believe, (and I have a feeling that there are many who believe so as well) that IT IS TIME to get a straight answer to STRAIGHT UP QUESTION and proceed from there.
Question TO: Quebec. DO YOU or DO YOU NOT consider yourselves to be Canadian province?
If yes, then you MUST respect the Canadian flag as well as the concept that despite there being two official languages, there is still ONLY ONE common language in Canada and that is English and THAT MUST BE respected as well.
We can all cherish the fact that we have French as a second language but…
If the answer is no you do not consider yourselves to be Canadian and thus consider yourselves to be a “separate nation” then you can NO LONGER benefit from Canadian tax payers transfer payments and infrastructure money. Not to mention, Canada’s health care system etc etc etc.
YOU CAN NO LONGER have it both ways.
Openly calling yourself a separate nation and acting like one while receiving all the benefits of being a province within the union of Canada.
Canadians accepting this situation is insane. It is basically them laughing at the ROC thinking to themselves ha, look how gullible they are. We are blatantly stepping all over the idea of being a “province” within Canada while at the same time taking their hard earned cash in order to build ourselves up towards the day when we CAN actually have enough infrastructure and so on having used them and their money then we CAN split and be comfortable doing so. (the CAQ saying we’ll wait 10 years to re-visit separation)
It’s like a bad relationship where the one partner is cheating on the other but when confronted say’s no no I love YOU.. And the other partner putting up with it because… Well, just because.
IT MUST STOP the ENGLISH MUST wake up and get some backbone and pride in their heritage culture and LANGUAGE. We MUST NO LONGER allow this country to be taken over in the manner in which it is being taken over now.
I don’t care what Kebec does as long as the $18 billion a year promoting bilingualism across this nation is stopped and as long as equalization payments are also stopped. Harper needs to do something to protect all Canadians from discriminatory language laws. We will never be a united country if he doesn’t. Our nation was not founded to be the way it is now, it is wrong just plain wrong.
When Harper and his Alberta born-again bozos won power, I kinda wanted to separate from Canada too. The good thing is that these neo-con nut-bars will be gone in 2015.
ON December 5, 2012 at 3:40 pm Ludwik (who, based on these kinds of statements —
“there are certain accommodations made with the intention of serving “our” historic Anglophone minority
— definitely comes across as “someone within the Quebec system”
wrote,“Quebec is both a province and a distinct nation.”
Bzzzt NOT… I (we Canadian tax payers and Canadian citizens in general) have a news bulletin FOR YOU and Quebec.
It ain’t possible.
Naw.. Nope no no no.. Quebec cannot have it both ways. Everyone SHOULD have learned this as a child. You either have the fudge bar or the rice crispy square — NOT BOTH. Quebec CANNOT continue to have it both ways. IT IS NOT acceptable no matter how many times you say it.
Ludwik also wrote, “In other words, speak any language you want, but the government speaks French and the language of work and instruction is also French.”
Yeah well this SHOULD BE APPLIED to the federal government of CANADA — you know the “REAL” Nation in this conversation — as well.
But no, Canada is what do the French call it when other s do it for them? Uhmmm oh yes, accommodating.
The only way Canada can realistically be kept together now is if Quebec accepts it’s place as a province within a country that has rules, customs and a culture of it’s own to protect. They MUST accept that the Canadian flag is to be respected as “their national flag” also, (likely wont’ happen) and that English is the common language of this country.
Anything other — is NOT acceptable.
Well said Eric — “A conversation without all of the emotion needs to take place. Not an 8 year make work project like the B & B Commission of the 60′s.
We need to remove the current path of government employees being allowed to work and be supervised in the language of their choice. We need to drastically reduce the amounts of money given for advancement of one language.”
Well said Kenneth Tillis — “How the heck they were given control over some of these major instituions in the first place is not really a mystery anymore. It’s time to take them back, abandon mandatory bilingualism and provide jobs for Canadians in the ROC.”
Well said Ken – “It would be much better for Quebec to separate and lets get this over with.”
Well said, Kathy — “I don’t care what Kebec does as long as the $18 billion a year promoting bilingualism across this nation is stopped and as long as equalization payments are also stopped. Harper needs to do something to protect all Canadians from discriminatory language laws. We will never be a united country if he doesn’t. Our nation was not founded to be the way it is now, it is wrong just plain wrong.”
AND I ADD insane that we allow this to be this way. Jezzzzus…
For much too lomg we have been misguided by the “Bilingual” issue. Canada needs to be English only in it’s politics and in every aspect. The French of Quebec and New Brunswick is a dead language. If the people want to keep their languages that’s fine. However we cannot Afford the high cost to this country at the cost of health care and poor pensions for the elderly. All people of Canada would gain by the change back to unilingual English. at the beginning it was done (bilingualism) was just to detract the people from noticing politicians raising their own pay and pensions. Whenever it’s ugly head was raised the politicians would rush through a bill to increase their own pay or pensions. Enough is enough. Now that Quebec has decided that they need French only, by the same arguements Canada needs English only. End of story.
I like Al in Cranbrook believe Mr.Harper does not wished to be dragged into political games some provinces prefer to play to encourage pondering to that same province.
There has been significantly less political pondering over the last number years and some Quebec politicians have used this as a divisive instrument between the federal and provincial institutions.
As for the future of Quebec in Canada ?
Quebec and the politicians in power continue along the path of isolationism,but the bigger issue is that the rest of Canada have become apathetic to Quebec’s issues and in fact many are calling for a Canada wide referendum to remove Quebec from Canada.
The path for Quebec for separation from Canada has already started many years ago ,but the question will it be them leaving or the rest of Canada asking them to leave?
Either way I would like to see our federal government stand up for all its citizens including the English in Quebec.The feds should be hiring by representation by population with regards to bilingualism .
If 20% are francophones within the country why must the government hire 65% bilingual ?This clearly ignores/discriminates against its majority to hire 250% above that quota!
The great thing is now the secret’s out of the closet and people are talking about the values of bilingualism enforced across the country!
NON FRANCOPHONE CANADIANS are waking up to the inequity of bilingualism when legislated and enforced by the government.
Thanks folks for Reading and contributing.
Language Fairness For All
In the past few years there has been a profound turnaround in the way the ROC views Quebec and it’s position in Canada. We are now intolerant of Quebec’s demands, share of the Transfer Payments, and of bi-bilingualism being an issue in selection of important positions in Government, Provincial or otherwise. Quebec doesn’t have enough Liberal or Conservative seats to make any difference to those parties, so they no longer have to pander to Quebec’s wishes. Quebec has become a wolf crying in the wilderness, with no one listening. Where this will lead is unknown right now but there certainly will be a major correction on the horizon for that Province.
To Al in Cranbrook,
Re: Harper would be the last to want to see Quebec separate!
Al, you are obviously not familiar with Stephen Harper’s rant in the Calgary Sun when he was with the reform Party:
“As a religion, bilingualism is the god that failed. It has led to no fairness, produced no unity, and cost Canadian taxpayers untold millions”.
Al, does this sound like someone who supports Quebec in Canada?
Message form Margeritte Ritchie:
“It is time for strong Provincial Premiers to draft a Constitution that does not include Quebec. Canadians must have a Canada that no longer enforces bilingualism or discrimination against our peoples.
The first step should be to shut off the funds that the Federal Government drains from other Provinces into Quebec. The second should be for Premiers to start urgent discussions with other Premiers and without the Premier of Quebec or the Prime Minister.
This is the only option. Contact everyone you know who can help you get this message into your Premier’s Office and into the media.
Can it be done? Yes. Quebec is not bound by the Constitution. Neither is any other Province. “
Of course Dear Leader wants Quebec to separate. It will be the beggining of the dissolution of the federation. Make no mistake, that IS the ultimate objective. Then the corporate sector can assume power in the remanants of a Balkanized Canada.
With all the personal stuff happening to me lately I had backed off on political blogs. This raises my hopes AND spirits. Excellent comments folks! Great article!
YES I want to help Kaybec separate.
Which do we discuss first? Borders? Shutting down of military installations on Kaybec (current) territory? Forfeiting passports? I am willing to help; hell, just establishing border crossings would employ hundreds or thousands of English Canadians!
And to those naysayers who say dividing a province cannot be done? Look at the Czech Republic. Can’t divide a city? I give you Berlin 1955 or Jerusalem present day. It CAN be done. It MUST be done. The sooner racist Kaybec is out of Canada the better.
As to who would replace Harper? No opposition leader has stood up for English Kaybec. Therefore we don’t vote for them or their party. Want to defeat the CPC? Defend Canadians trapped in a hostile area. If you don’t, new leaders who do so will emerge.
According to one historian, John T. Saywell, the mandate for the B&B Commission of inquiry was very imprecise:
“The terms of reference were deceptive; …The Commissioners felt they had been called upon to refashion the state, and not just its framework but its foundations. They made it clear in their first working paper that they were …concerned …with the idea of equal partnership, which they described as the mainspring (l’idée-force) of the Commission and noted…they were not even limited by the terms of the constitution”.
Here is a long list of historical documents and memoirs attesting to that:
It’s good to see historical documents confirm feelings of many Canadians that they have been conned.
Balkanized Canada – more like “the North American Trade Union” – counter part to Europe! The New World Order has arrived. Hold on to your seats!
Rev 17:16-17 “And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore(Apostate Christendom), and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast(Antichrist), until the words of God shall be fulfilled”.
Yes Syd45 ,
There is about to be a big correction coming to Quebec ,the rest of Canada is becoming increasingly intolerant of a culturally biased ,racist province whose interest are not of Canada but of itself first !
Bilingualism with J.Allan(reputable financial researcher) stated costing the country $ 3.1 trillion since inception for a net gain of 300,000 more bilingual people certainly our country could have reduced poverty ,national debt 6 x over ,or many more noble causes that would serve ALL people then placating one cultural group.
When the government chooses an individual for employment purely on language as 60-65% of federal jobs are designated bilingual -this discriminates against those that are uni lingual you know the 83% of Canadians.
I find it hard to grasp that 83% Canadians are willing to except discrimination by their own government through hiring policies !!!
Ontario is not yet deemed bilingual for that 4.8% ,yet most provincial jobs are deemed bilingual ,is this not the cart before the horse?
Our local health unit 100% bilingual for a 20% francophone community ,wait there there are as well 9 LOCAL FRENCH ONLY HEALTH UNITS NO ENGLISH ALLOWED. Yet all provicial institutions provide bilingualism!!!
Alexandria Ontario -french only buses
Is this not segregation? all at the taxpayers expense!
USA has progressed from segregation yet Ontario is progressing to it?
Why has society allowed this?
When has it become normalized to allow segregation for one culture only?? At the cost to the taxpayer!
ON December 5, 2012 at 8:49 pm J the M wrote, “Of course Dear Leader wants Quebec to separate. It will be the beggining of the dissolution of the federation.”
To coin a French phrase, au contraire J the M. It will be ONLY the beginning of the way “things REALLY SHOULD be and should have been done some time ago. After all, the French and Quebec do have a distinctness and it is clear that because of this distinctness they really DON’T wish to be Canadian. So, why are we beating around the bush and trying to jam a square peg into a round hole while spending untold millions (which could be put to better use.) Let’s be friendly and nice about the whole thing just simply accept that this is the way it HAS TO BE so that we don’t end up with COMPLETE resentment for one another — which i see coming if this continues this way — AND NO, being friendly and nice DOES NOT mean Quebec can walk about with all we Canadian tax payers have invested in that place over the past several decades.
Nope, no dissolution at all. Course, Quebec will no doubt go through a 10 or 15 year period of, shall we call it, “readjustment” from being taken from the cradle and off the Canadian nipple but, that is but one of the inevitable growing pains it MUST go through.
English Canada simply CANNOT allow this take over to continue unabated any longer.
This whole — you accommodate us MORE AND MORE while we shit all over your flag your language and your English citizens in this “province” while also accommodating you even less — kind of attitude which the French are blatantly getting away with now is simply no longer acceptable.
SO DON’T worry folks. Canada is NOT going to fall apart if Quebec leaves. It will actually be MUCH better off in many ways without the teenager living in the basement who takes it for granted and only shows itself when it wants to suck more money and jobs from it’s bowls.
Besides, we know the secret to making poutine and ragu now so we’ll be fine. Course, we can always have those things as trade-able items as well 🙂
J the M, get a grip. It is Canadians who don’t want Quebec in Canada.
Harper said it himself “Canada is NOT a bilingual country.”
in an article he wrote, which appeared in the Calgary Sun in 2001…
John Macdonald, are you sure we do things differently? The Rebellions of 1837, 1885 and the FLQ come to mind. Of course, Canada did Vimy Ridge differently in 1917.
Lou Re: border crossings
Lou, while travelling between Germany, Austria, Switzerland and Italy in 1999, I encountered “0” border crossings. I am certain that the only border crossing in continental Europe is in the USSR so why would Quebec require a border crossing?
Good point Eric. But those rebellions pale in comparison to the civil war, and they went on as long as they did due in part to American involvement. But Canadians are largely a peaceful lot. A key phrase in our constitution is peace order and good government. Quebec wants to separate? Have a vote not a war. Quebec wants to maintain its French identity? OK. Sure, we have our extremists. But they never amount to much. Reform was a mainstream party but still died out because they weren’t accommodating enough. Hudak will make selling the LCBO part of his platform to get elected on but will never adopt any of the wacko ideas advocated here. We a peaceful people.
we are waiting with baited breath to see what will happen at 10:am this morning ! will the world keep turning? Will Stephen Harper magically intervene and wipe out a whole Canadian province? Will big business grow a heart and lead us all to the land of OZ? Next Federal election King Stephen will be relegated to 4 seats in the house of Commons(remisnicent of the apres Mulroney years) and the democracy will be intact… one vote ,one citizen…
What a good collection of opinions!! It is clear now that the English-speakers are waking up after over 40 years of abuse. I applaud all the commentators who don’t believe that Canada will fall apart if Quebec leaves. Harper believes that Canada was created as a Confederation (according to the BNA, 1867) wherein each province is given a lot of powers which have since Trudeau’s days been high-jacked by the Federal government. That is what the Liberal government has done over the past 40+ years. The centralization was done so that the Federal government could control the provincial governments through its purse-strings. The Feds “rewarded” the provinces if these provinces followed the Federal program. For example, provinces like B.C. with just over 1% French-speakers were given a lot of money to establish French Immersion schools and to support several French organizations whose sole purpose is to create Francophiles (i.e. people who think that the French language & culture are valuable assets). Minister Moore was a graduate of such institutions and the sole reason he was given that lucrative position.
The really sad thing about this policy is that it has failed in more ways than one. It has cost billions over the 40+ years and it has not created a bilingual population. The 17% “self-declared” bilinguals is in reality only about 12% if they are assessed by government-initiated tests. Most of all, it has failed to unite the country. The province of Quebec, for which this divisive policy was created, has turned its back on Canada and uses the Separatist Shtick to force more concessions from us.
In the process of forcing bilingualism on the work-force, it has created a high level of stress and is probably why our public servants have such a high rate of absenteeism and poor morale.
Mr. Newton’s bible quote nailed it. Quebec has to go!
December 6, 2012 at 12:00 pm
Now Ed do you actually have constructive comments ,Or is it always negative undertones?
Quebec must except equal status among ALL the provinces ,political pandering will no longer work and only frustrate other provinces and further alienate themselves.
Kim well said -J.Allan estimated 3.1 trillion since onset of the OLA -for a net increase of 0.45% increase in bilingualism.If this were a business it would have been dropped a long time ago as it would be considered a poor return on that investment.
But then again it is the sacred cow isn’t it?
We need representation by population in government hires -This has far been abused and equality must come back!
Canadians will demand change! why must 80% of Canadians not be able to work for their own government ?
December 6, 2012 at 9:08 am
“A key phrase in our constitution is peace order and good government.”
Good point! But Good Government is lost in its respect to its majority ,why is it the majority cannot work for their own government ?For the only reason of a minority language so where is the representation of that said majority?
Maybe the issue is that we want to be just like our American neighbors… Yes, the United States have only one official language and a very patriotic approach, but Americans are also known for blindly following their leaders no matter what. I’m an Ontarian born in Quebec. Many countries have more than one official language and they do just fine. They wouldn’t change that for the world. It’s part of their culture… Many, many countries are divided within, culturally, lingually… It may be more difficult to manage but does that mean they should just become heterogenous and unilingual? Should we? Makes it easier, I guess… Makes it kinda bland too if you ask me.
My mom was born and raised in Montréal and my dad is French (France). I was raised in French but you wouldn’t know that from speaking with me. I’m bilingual but speak mostly English, out of choice. Personally, I love that we have 2 official languages, it’s what sets us apart, makes us different than our American friends.
Even raised in Quebec I always a strong patriotic love for Canada. Ticked me off when other kids would say they were Quebecer, not Canadian… I’m Canadian, no compromise. I also love Quebec, it’s different, quirky, part of who I am, part of who we are. We are also the nation with the most cosmopolitan city in the world. 43% of the residents of Toronto were not BORN in Canada. That’s huge! I’m pretty proud of that too…
Perhaps I’m an idealist but instead of trying to push away Quebec in order to be more like big brother US we should consider finding ways to work together to claim who we are: bilingual, culturally rich, cosmopolitan, Canadian…
Sorry Highlander, but anyone whose Canada includes Quebec is generally not welcomed around here.
TO Kim and Highlander:
Excellent blogs. The best part of these blogs is that Canadians are awakening, with thunder, and not the preverbal thud, as in the past.
The negative responses posted here, is a reflection of the fear that is seeping into the supporters of forced bilingualism.
We are on our way to taking the next step, and that is forming pressure groups to lean on politicans to actually address our concerns in government.
We need leaders and a strong grass roots movement.
And its about time, we begin not to FEAR what we stand for, the other side has depended on this fear for decades. It is refreshing to read and by extension, see how this fear is being eliminated.
DON’T QUIT AND KEEP ON FIGHTING for the rights we have democratically earned.
If (MODERATED) quebec goes, ole, and as I stated many, many times before, the sooner the better.
@ james quealey. Were you born with your shorts in a knot? Your hatred of Quebec and Quebecers seems way over the top. Just because you are unhappy with what’s going on at this particular time in our history, you squawk and scream that Canada should be dismantled? Thankfully, people obsessed with kicking Quebec out of Canada are pretty much ignored or laughed at by the vast majority of Canadians.
We’re gonna break up one of the most successful democracies on the planet because you, and people like you are pissed off? I think not.
Sir, I have lived in quebec for 40 years. my entire family was forced out of this entity by the laws of quebec.
Bill 101, restricted education, language police and the like. I and people like me, have endured times that you can’t image.
The largest migration since ww11 was from quebec after the 1976 election of the P.Q. government. 400,000 left
Look it up
NOT ONE CANADIAN POLITICIAN LIFTED A FINGER TO SUPPORT OR PROTECT ANGLO RIGHTS IN quebec.
If you have any knowledge of historty , from the treay of proclaimation, through the quebec act 1774 through the various attempts at appeasement, you would know there are 2 distinct Canadas, wheather you would want to admit this or not.
I want ALL CANADIANS, ENGLISH, FRENCH OR WHATEVER, to have EQUAL rights in all jurisdictios that carry a Canadian passport.
Today, this is NOT the case. quebec plays by a very different set of rules, I know, I was subjected to them. This fact will not change.
Therefore inequality and anti-English laws will prevail there.
That is NOT MY CANADA sir.
When 62% of the federal jobe are allotted to francophones, mainly because they are french and not because of merit, in a country where 82% of the population is English, then the balances are tilted.
The fact that we have sent a quarter of a trillion in Canadian subsidies and grants to quebec since 1958 ( Stats Can) and a Canadian in quebec cannot even put up an english sign for his/her business speakes volumes.
In quebec you may put up a french and other languae sign EXCEPT ENGLISH What does that say to you Ed?
Please ,sir ,you do not know me, I am just as angary at Canada as I am at the laws of quebec, for NOT FIGHTING for the ANGLOS that were sacrificed in the of Appeaseing of quebec-
And what was the reward for appeasement -the laws there are harsher and more anti-English
Any time you want to debate me on the History of this country in general and quebec in particular let me know.
My credentials are impeccable in this area.
It fascinates me how people makes bad comparisons with other countries. Quebec and Canada are different. Different nation, different language, different values, different everything. Making a single country with 2 different nations was a mistake from the beginning. Lets separate and be good neighbors.
Re: POST by Milevic ON December 6, 2012 at 1:42 pm
Like you, “I was raised in Quebec and always had a strong love for Canada.” And. also like you, “I love Quebec” (quirky is a good descriptive) PLUS, I TOTALLY agree with your statement that it is, “a different, quirky, part of who I am, part of who we are.” I like that, and how you said it. And I do believe this is a fact.
However, I suspect — this may be a one way street — and thus maybe even THEEEEE problem.”
It is clear to many that this does not work the same way in reverse.
Canada/English/and the English culture is NOT part of who “they are” in that same way. It is not accepted as a good feeling to them the way you explained how we feel the French is part of this country and part of our good feeling about it.
From their view, the bland English — here we are — relaxed and easy going kind of Canadian experience IS NOT where it’s at…
Proof of this is the idea that —
The English language and culture along and the Canadian flag are practically a diseases within the “province” of Quebec. ( don’t; buy the save our culture and language excuse as a reason for this btw)
Further more, I doubt that ANYONE has a problem with the whole wonderful idea of knowing more than one language and being in a country that is diverse as a result of that having two official languages.
HOWEVER… The “process” has NOT been one of simply… This is what it is, along with a general acceptance of what is.
It was more a process of — This is what we’re going to do and what WE WANT. And YOU are simply going to take it. And, at the same time love the fact that we are jamming it down your throat. Oh and, on top of that — YOU, yes you.. THE majority English — in a country that has English as the common language — You are not only going to pay for this privilege as well, but once we are more entrenched we will have it so that you are minimized for jobs and positions within your own government and country as well.
As a matter of fact even your own Prime Minister will have to speak French and thus he/she will be chosen from only only 18 % of all of the Canadian population.
Judging by how well spoken you were in your comment Milevic I am quite sure you will see that this is not as healthy and wonderful a situation as you painted about those “other places” and how they got to be wonderful multi-language places.
Stephane December 6, 2012 at 5:44 pm
“It fascinates me how people makes bad comparisons with other countries. Quebec and Canada are different. Different nation, different language, different values, different everything. Making a single country with 2 different nations was a mistake from the beginning. Lets separate and be good neighbors.”
YES YES YES.. RIGHT ON Stephanie. A voice of reason.
Trust me, it won’t cause the end of Canada. As long as the separation agreements are fair… It will be better for EVERYONE.
@ james quealey. I lived in Quebec from 1948 until 1972. I loved it then and I still do. Are those dang French speakers taking over Mississauga too? If you are still traumatizes from living in Quebec, maybe you should consider some therapy. I thought Mississauga would be a pretty safe and comfortable place for Francophobes.
Milevic…..you are true Canadian!!! Most here, as you probably know by now, do not share our views. Thank-you for standing proud and having the fortitude to share your views.
PLEASE DO NOT RESPOND **smile**
Yep James……..we are so afraid, keep dreaming!!! Wondering what we, the french are afraid of? Can’t figure that one out. What do we have to lose? I will answer……nothing. French will all exist. Yep, the english (this bunch) will be dictating how this country should be run and where and how our tax dollars should be spent. It’s people with this type of mentality that are frightening and can destroy a peaceful nation. James….have you ever thought of moving out of the country. Perhaps another country will treat you better **smile**
Already…they are pushing to seperate the country. Folks this was brought a year ago and they denied it saying they were fighting for fairness…….interesting.
They keep bringing up jobs. I quote…..”Why must 80% of Canadians not be able to work for our gov”? Talk about exageration. So that must mean that 80% of gov workers are from another country…..hmmm One doesn’t need a Masters Degree to see the fabrication that this gang does on a daily basisis. With all the cutbacks there are only so many jobs to go around…….HELLO!!!!
Majority means nothing…..got that? We are all Canadians first and foremost. The majority in our nation want peace and unity and the MAJORITY wants it to remain that way. We are the envy of the world…….quit trying to change that image.
Wow Jim Q. where HAVE YOU BEEN! We’ve been bitchn’ here for months and months when you come along and say the whole issue in one swoop. Thank you for your frankness and honesty.
BLAME PIERRE ELLIOT TRUDEAU and his henchmen back in the late 60’s and for the rest of his tenure in politics. This whole mess was in their plans and it is working.
It would have been best if the federallies had arrested Pauline Marois and charged her for treason for her magic trick of replacing the red and white with the white and blue for her swearing ceremonials. You know if this keeps up we will be saluting the Fleur on top of the Canadian Parliament……..just what they are aiming for JIM Q.
Best yet, when the country is converted, we will see the bilingual policy dumped so there’ll be no need for ENGLISH translations or duplications anymore. Just imagine the billions of dollars Quebec, er’ Canada will save then.
@Milevic “we should consider finding ways to work together to claim who we are: bilingual, culturally rich, cosmopolitan, Canadian…”
Just one to point something out Milevic. “WE ARE NOT ALL BILINGUAL”. Lucky for you you grew up with both languages but that was a pretty clueless statement you made about the rest of us. However, yes would love to work with you, even though my culture would be different than yours. That’s all we are asking.
On December 6, 2012 at 4:28 pm Ed wrote, “james quealey. Were you born with your shorts in a knot? Your hatred of Quebec and Quebecers seems way over the top.”
Ed, you will have to go a little easier on james. You see he was not always like this. It is a condition that has progressed over many years and direct result of many wrong doings by the French. Time and time again he tried to let go of each transgression. Like for example back when they passed Bill 22. Her let that go, then 178 (i think it was after that) he let that go too. Then came 101 and THAT may have been the final straw. That’s right. He didn’t just wake up like that one day. IT WAS A DIRECT RESULT of the actions of the French themselves. You know, action / reaction. It’s not a difficult concept. If you put your hand in a fire, it WILL burn. It you treat English people like dirt while they are still living right within their own country they WILL get piS8*^&%ed off. I am sure you can understand…
So on behalf of james and many other English Canadian people who have seen their flag burned and their language outlawed while they have been stepped on and looked past for work in their own country i say to you…
Have a nice day eh 🙂