CFN – Is it time to boycott all things Quebec? A boycott is a severe thing; but with Bill 14 looming and the strange occurrences since the last election there that never seem to be resolved could it be best if people give La Belle Province a wide berth for awhile?
Don’t get me wrong; as a former Montrealer there are many things I still love about the once great city.
But I could go a summer without Schwartz’s and steamies if it makes a statement.
Frankly I visit “back home” less and less. It’s not just the crazed roads and constant construction. It’s not just the all too more frequent customer service issues if I dare speak “Anglais”.
It’s this darn Bill 14. It’s the fact that things became so bad in Quebec that the people of Quebec decided to grant Ms Marois a government.
In Canada we still have free choice; and frankly my choice is leaning towards making my little statement. My one little token of boycotting Quebec until after Labour Day. I think I can do it.
Yes, I’ll still visit my family; but I won’t be dining or spending any money there. Do I expect my little boycott to change anything? Not really; but imagine if millions of people did?
Politicians rely on people never doing anything no matter how badly they behave. They’re used to manipulating small groups of people to grab power. When I wrote during the student tuition protests that it simply was PQ agitation I think the election results showed how right myself and many others of the same belief were.
Quebec made its choice. In some ways I think it was a good one because people can focus on the brutally ugly culture of linguistic facism that exists. Francophones in Quebec will have to realize that the only people that can save French in Quebec are Francophones. Anglophones, and Allophones are not to blame and not the issue. It’s time to stop punishing the English language and culture hoping that Quebec will become some Francophone Mecca.
Until Quebec changes its ways the results will essentially be the same.
Now the big question is why the Federal government remains so silent on what’s happening to Canadians living in Quebec that don’t subscribe to the provincially mandated madness, and why they are abdicating those citizens rights…
Jamie Gilcig – Editor – CFN
(Comments and opinions of Editorials, Letters to the Editor, and comments from readers are purely their own and don’t necessarily reflect those of the owners of this site, their staff, or sponsors.)
One thing you don’t get howard is who are you going to get to serve francophones if some anglos refuse to learn french ? Representation by population doesn’t apply, I’d rather have the most qualified person for the job. If one of the requirements is to provide services to francophones, where would be the logic in hiring a unilingual anglo ? You’re expecting everyone else to learn english so you don’t have to learn french. So in your opinion, does every minority have to conform to the will of the majority. Lets create one perfect language…and then move on to one perfect race. Then again, forget it, someone tried it, he almost succeeded. I don’t think that is what you’re trying to do..in my humble opinion, you’re just being lazy.
Eric, nope, let’s just shave a 2 to 3 billion of of the billions wasted on planes and the Canada action plan. (BIG BIG waste of money in my opinion, just used for conservative photo ops).
This is too funny…..LMAO!!! Everytime Richard brings up the name Howard, highlander responds……why wouldn’t anyone else think that Richard is adressing them when Richard says Howard….too funny!!!!
Rosie…..let me say this. It is the employers right to hire whomever they think is the best candidate. If I wanted a bilingual person that is who I would hire.
Diplomas doon’t necessarily guarantee anyone a job, there is much more to an interview then meets the eye.
@ admin:
Correction : my post today at 11:38a.m., was to Jamie, and not ot Peter, as posted,
apologies for my error, I have very, bad eyesight.
@ Stella and Richard Tremblay and you others too
I would like you to check out the Imperatif Français site.
Address : http://www.imperatif@imperatif-francais.org
You’ll find a on line petition, the francophone students and parents of Saskatchuwan are asking us to sign to help them get a very much needed school.
Please sign it, it’s important.
That goes for you others too. The request is in both official languages and will show you that I/we are not exagerating, when we say, that Anglos in Québec, have it better, than any other minority, in Canada and in the world.
@ richard trembly
yes the minority does have to conform to the will of the majority. Its called democracy. Translators can be provided at very little cost, if needed.
quebec does this, and with no translators. so if quebec can do it, then Canada should follow suit.
Here is how I see Richard’s/Stella’s/Pierre’s comments:
If not for the fact that government-sponsored laws are Pro-French and someone was speaking out against, say, a Pro-German language law – you wouldn’t see half of the response; if none at all towards the subject.
But, because the laws are beneficial to those whose first language is French; then they feel they have something to gain and/or lose in all of this.
Now, LFA advocates for Language Fairness for All. To illustrate my point, as a board member, myself and other LFA members publicly stated that we would help out Stella’s Francophone friend who supposedly lost out on a job to an English speaking person while her friend was on vacation.
LFA sternly believes that NO Job applicant should lose out nor be granted first class citizen special privileges due to a language(s) they speak – especially in regards to applying and getting jobs.
If the French language was ever boycotted in Ontario much like the English language is currently boycotted in Quebec you can be rest assured that LFA would be protesting in Ontario over that unfairness. For it would contradict the very reason for LFA’s existence if we sat back and did nothing.
Now ask yourself, if Stella and Pierre had nothing to gain nor lose over this issue, would we see such stringent, ethnocentric behaviour from them?
Methinks they wouldn’t raise their fingers to hit the keys.
Cory
Richard tremblay
March 19, 2013 at 3:48 pm
“One thing you don’t get howard is who are you going to get to serve francophones if some anglos refuse to learn french ? Representation by population doesn’t apply, I’d rather have the most qualified person for the job.”
So you are saying that representation by population is not measurable fair ,and equitable?
So having the most qualified person is the one that is bilingual ?
So all people must learn french to serve that 23%?
Welcome social engineering.
Most just democracies would never have a problem with representation by population -so you are saying Richard we are not a just democracy ?
Richard tremblay
March 19, 2013 at 3:54 pm
“Eric, nope, let’s just shave a 2 to 3 billion of of the billions wasted on planes and the Canada action plan. (BIG BIG waste of money in my opinion, just used for conservative photo ops).”
See Richard you showing your political colors ,But why not shave the money from bilingualism as this only represents a small part of the population.
You see if you want to promote bilingualism do it on your own dollar rather then the majorities.
Many cultures do not need this form of welfare to maintain their culture as they support it personally.
All this does is keep French on artificial life support ,If you are unable to maintain your own culture ,why must you depend on other cultures to keep it alive “TEACH IT TO YOUR OWN”.
stellabystarlight
March 19, 2013 at 4:24 pm
Richard assumes I am Howard ,he said it a number of times.
Diplomas doon’t necessarily guarantee anyone a job, there is much more to an interview then meets the eye.
Yes there is more then an education -FRENCH otherwise why refuse applicants if they are not deemed bilingual.
Pierre
March 19, 2013 at 6:00 pm
You’ll find a on line petition, the francophone students and parents of Saskatchuwan are asking us to sign to help them get a very much needed school.
Yup like the one up north that cost near 10 million for 50 students!!!!!
Hey Pierre you still did not answer my question -do you believe in measurable, fair and equitable approach to language services such as representation by population?
@ pierre,
Me thinks, all wwould be much better off, if you went your way and we go ours. quebec, and by extension francophones can then all that they want and PAY for it as well.
We in Canada, could then have all that we want , and the English, free from this curse of bilingualism.
richard, pierre and stella, would be in heaven, living in quebec, and could do and say all that they espouse to. Pay quebec,taxes, use the quebec franc, and garner all of the world welfae state, because they would have the world’s 5th largest debt losad, but, the fleur de lys will cure all.
Remember when marois was supporting the students in their tuition fight. Well, she is now backing down. Typical
@highlander
You make connections that are so crazy, it’s unbelievable.
But you’re right in that we do not have a fair approach to language services. Anglos, in Québec, get to much of the public purse for their education, and as you can see, if you bothered to check the web site, at the address, I posted, you know that the francophone in Saskatchuwan don’t get their fair share of the pie either…
But, I’m sure that you(s) think that it’s fine that the Francophone students, in Saskatchuwan are bunched together, in two groups, one from the first grade to the fift, and another from the sixth grade to the tenth, and if there not happy with that, there’s a proposal, to bunch them, in the kitchen, of an other englisn school.
I’ve read the comments posted below that article and everybody is scandalized by that injustice, even some fair-minded Anglos write to express their disgust.
But not you guys, eh. (sic, sic, sic).
Ok, this is addressed to the G.
You wrote ¨take the money from bilingualism as this only represents a small part of the population.¨
¨You see if you want to promote bilingualism do it on your own dollar rather then the majorities.¨
¨If you are unable to maintain your own culture ,why must you depend on other cultures to keep it alive “TEACH IT TO YOUR OWN¨
Isnt that in a sense some sort of social engineering ? And, I’m sorry to be blunt be really really discriminatory comments, and dare I say racist.
Richard tremblay says ” You’re expecting everyone else to learn English so you don’t have to learn french. ”
As most of us are in Ontario, take a look at the pure economics of teaching French to English only speakers 8,677,040 out of 12,722,065 would be crazy expensive even if you could find that many teachers.
The Canada wide bilingualism rate was 17.4% in 2006 to 17.5% in 2011, hardly the explosion that was referred to from another posting, and was due to more bilingual reported in Quebec. So 82.5% are NOT bilingual and teaching them French is kind of expensive.
http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2011/as-sa/98-314-x/2011001/fig/fig3-eng.cfm
Pierre
March 19, 2013 at 10:21 pm
Now pierre you didn’t answer my question:
-do you believe in measurable, fair and equitable approach to language services such as representation by population?
Richard tremblay
March 20, 2013 at 4:22 am
This is not the G ,but those are the comments I made.
“Isnt that in a sense some sort of social engineering ? And, I’m sorry to be blunt be really really discriminatory comments, and dare I say racist.”
So now you are calling me a racist ?I am anything but the sort !!!
But sir now you have degraded the debate by calling people names.
This is not a surprise coming from you and your ilk ,as without proper debate you go into character assassination mode.
Please tell me how you have come to that conclusion !
You may disagree with people without having to insult them ,but at last for your ilk that may not be possible.
Isnt that in a sense some sort of social engineering ?
Obviously you do not get the concept of social engineering,its usually forced by the STATE like in Canada with FRENCH on the remaining population you know where “numbers do not warrant”.
oh yes and have a good day ****smile****
@ pierre, richard, stella
all want bilingualism in the nine provinces that make up English Canada. But not one of these people listed here , pirere , richard and stella, want bilingualism in quebec. yet quebec, albeit in name only is still in Canada
Why is that ? So far there has not been one iota of evidence to justify why quebec is not bilingual. I defy anyone to PROVE that the french were ever in danger of loosing their language or culture.
What the francophones want, is to use the ISSUE of bilingualism to suck every red cent out of Canada , in order to promote french, and in the long run gain POWER over the English in Canada.
This is what bilingualism is about. CONTROL AND POWER.
it is why they are so fearful of publications such as this, because it gives the English in Canada , a vehicle to understand, and vent , on issues that politicians won’t touch. It also educates people , on just how unequal and unfair these proposals for bilingualism are.
Remember, THE PEN IS ALWAYS MIGHTIER THAN THE SWORD.
francophones, , in quebec, were successful in intimidating politicians in to getting their own way. Make no mistake, threats of violence for speaking up for anglo rights in quebec, werre met with threats and violence.. ask Mr, Galganov, if any one doubts this. Look at what happened with mayor Gendron in Huntington quebec, after he locked horns with L.Office de la screw Les Anglais. Both he and wife’s car were trashed and his home fire bombed.
This is the ONLY way, that the french operate in quebec.
this is also what they are trying to push here, with “forced bilingualism”
@ c cameron
{MODERATED}that includes all or the FLA members.
First of all. The government sponsored laws (call em what it they, bilingualism)…
You(s) dream up millions ways to say the same thing.
Of course tax payers pay the cost of bilingualism. That’s a given. We pay for everything.
But, it benifits all of Canada because without it, the canadian federation, would break up. It’s that simple.
And a majority of Canadians agree with bilingualism.
So yes, I and Stella and Richard benifit from bilingualim.
My God, the nonsense you say, and that we have to respond to.
If, a German speaking state had been a part of the federation since before it’s conception, and had been one of it’s recognized founding people, of course, those Canadians would demand the same rights that the Québécois do. We would then, have three official languages, in Canada…
How could you and the other xenophobia and ethnocentric posters and all the FLA members live in such a country?
You would be one unhappy clan, eh.
You can try to dress it up differently, sugarcoat it, as it where, but nobody, with an open mind, is duped.
The lost cause/mission of the FLA is to treat the Francophone of this country as members of a second class founding people of Canada. and kill the French language by renderion it obsolete.
Nobody ever lost a job in Canada, because of the language they speak… That would be ethnic racism.
Some have lost jobs because of a language they did not speak…
That is not racism it is fairness.
And many more have not qualified for jobs that were disignated bilingual. That is also fair especially, considering how easy learning ones second official language has become in this country.
” If the French language was ever boycotted, in Ontario as the English language is in Québec, FLA would be protesting, in Ontario, over that unfairness”…
What a crock… What a bundle of bull.
Québec has to protect the language of it’s majority against anglicisation. All open-minded Canadians understand that. it’s so obvious. You can call it boycotting the English language, if you want, but the fact remains, that the Anglos are still better treated, in Québec, than the Francophone are being treated, in the ROC. And they retain their language more easily the Francophone do, too.
You, and LFA, are not helping the Francophone, at all. You are trying to destroy any chance of their surviving.
PROOF : I have asked the posters and the readers of this blog, to come to the aid of some Francophone students in Saskatchuwan, because a great injustice is being perpetrated, on them, by their government.
Did you, or your clan, show any concern or bother to fill the on line petition. I think not…
You are so full of bull, cory Cameron.
@CONCERNED CITIZEN 2
Could you please clarify what your reference to me being “delusional” is about and what “habitual liar” pertains to? I would then be only to glad to offer a response to your query.
I have taken the liberty of browsing the archives and have encountered many opinions and some truth. I have tried, with providing my own points of view, to simply participate and offer a more decorous perspective to this format.
Pierre, The link you offered (French only by the way) complains because a private business English radio station in Ottawa has paid bus shelter posters in English and is threatening Quebec assimilation. This site openly is against teaching English in Quebec schools. This site complains because a conference in Calgary is asking for English speakers. There are more of course, but the school help you request does say an offer of the school board to host in another school is not wanted, saying it will lead to more assimilation of our young francophone’s.
The town has 0 French only speakers out of 560 residents and how many school age kids would there be in the 18% 14 and under group?They are already assimilated and should look again at using buildings already in existence in fairness to taxpayers that are willing to help people learn French.
@STELLABYSTARLIGHT
To answer your questions directed to me Stella, I offer the following;
You have on many occasions now wanted to know why concern is coming from sources outside of Quebec over internal matters of provincial focus and authority, specifically alluding to language laws.
While it is quite easy to answer simply as I have in the past that Quebec is part of Canada and therefore all matters concerning one province potentially should be the concern of all Canadians I will provide you with a more logical and less emotional justification.
Pierre and for that matter Stella all the other contributors who purport to be informed regarding the official languages act will concede and agree with the following statement of fact.
Money to finance part of the funding of providing minority (English) services in the province of Quebec is available through a
transfer payment from the Federal Government of Canada.
We can get into the issue of what the ramifications to withhold these services in English despite the availability of funds means
however Pierre would no doubt agree that the withholding of services does not breach Canadian laws.
With regards to your question, “What is the big deal, when it has been going on for 100 years?”
The big deal Stella is that over and above the simple truth that language issues in Canada have been a divisive force on a world level we are the only nation that uses taxpayers dollars to fund a political party whose principal purpose is to sever governance ties
with its own country, a breaking of allegiance ( which by definition is a treasonous act ). That is a big deal Stella.
@ pierre,
You speak of proof, ok?
Where is the proof that the french language was ever in danger?
Where is the proof, that their culture was ever in danger?
Why do the french not recognize that it was the french themselves that were responsible the English domination in quebec?
Why did quebec premiers of the first half of the last century
refuse Canada’s offer to industrialize quebec ?
What is the “justification” for laws that are the most anti-English, xenaphobic , racist laws ever perpatrated on a free society any where ?
Why has the U.N. condemned these quebec anti- English laws ?
What is the basis for your claim that quebec, will be assimilated ?
Why are the English so mistreated and vilified in quebec?
What have the English ever, done to the french to merit this treatment? Please provide as you SAY the proof OF ALL OF THE ABOVE.
Where do you get your information from , that you base your claims on ?
pierre, I have two degrees in History, from Mc Gill university, I believe , I know a thing or two about quebec, since I was born and lived there half of my life, and Canadian History.
Can you ,stella, richard provide similar qualifications to make the claims that you do , or are your claims simply opinions based on supposition and rumor ?
@HIGHLANDER
I concede that the point of view was the offered via the Huffington Post. My question was, however, offered to you as to why each province should be a clone rather than have as they do individual differences. How can each province be a clone with two different forms of law existing within our boundaries ( common law and civil law ). I chose to be married in Quebec because of the differences in the law specifically the more respectfully treatment of woman with regards to their status within marriage.
Regarding “representation by population” section 32 of the amended Official Languages Act deals with this concern. So I interpret your concerns to be provincial in nature rather than federal. Having said that differences in provincial matters are simply a fact of life here in Canada, as they are between states south of the border and else where around the globe.
All Canadians enjoy the simple right of mobility without restriction within Canada’s borders (except residents on or visitors to Cornwall Island and other parts of the same reserve, but that is a separate issue). Therefore we are free to locate wherever we feel most inclined to. The issue than is that many take exception to Quebec not reciprocating specifically when it comes to provincial matters of language. Highlander despite contravening federal laws
the Province of Manitoba did not adhere to the Official Languages Act of 1969 until forced to by enactment of the law in, I believe, 1985. Putting the shoe on the other Canadian foot how would you having been a francophone in Manitoba going to appear before a court and not having your right to trial in French being honoured ? I only to well understand the issues we face and that you take so much to heart but the change that needs to occur is not so much within the province of Quebec but rather the fool hardly position that we take elsewhere in CANADA . Quite simply put Highlander if the remainder of Canada followed Quebec’s stance with regards to language laws the issue would become a none issue after time, think about it. A level playing field creates
an environment for accord.
BIG THANK YOU Eric… RE: your work in bringing to this to light… WELL DONE.
ON March 20, 2013 at 12:23 pm Eric began his “outing of Pierre’s idiocy” with,
“Pierre, The link you offered
http://www.imperatif@imperatif-francais.org
(French only by the way)”
I checked it out… AND
Talk about freaking DOUBLE SPEAK extraordinaire…
The first article on that site starts with this PURE example of double speak,
–
“Welcome to our website which promotes freedom of opinion and freedom of expression for the world’s cultural diversity —- through the promotion of the French language. “
–
It seems this “promoting freedom of opinion and freedom of expression” only applies to — French freedom of opinion and French freedom of expression —
————————-
The article from the site below goes on to doing the exact opposite of “promoting freedom of opinion and freedom of expression”
Tuesday, March 19, 2013 6:47 p.m.
BILINGUALISM “WALL TO WALL” TO THE GOVERNMENT OF QUEBEC
Unbelievable but true!
On the one hand, the Government of Québec stipulates in Article 3 of the Government’s policy on employment and the quality of the language in the Administration that “the Administration favors unilingual French in its activities.
On the other hand, the government “imposes” the contrary in the collective agreements of the Union of Professionals of the Quebec government and the Union of Public and parastatal Quebec, where a similar bill opens the door wide to dun dun dun duuuuuuuuu — bilingualism–
Eric also exposed the fact that, “The town has ZERO French only speakers out of 560 residents.”
I haven ‘t verified this part yet but i have ZERO reason to believe it’s incorrect.
Holeee macenaw… Jesssssssusssss H.
And Pierre has the cajones to ask us to go help further the cause of putting English people at a disadvantage?
Nice try bud…
I must be having a bad dream/nightmare. I can hardly believe the gall – or should i say (de Gaulle) — of these people…
This is what we’re up against … Those who could care less about the English language or bilingualism for that matter.
@ pierre denault
I would like to very much address your post today at 10:55 a.m.
I will take each and every relevant point and respond:
You claim that a majority of Canadians agree with bilingualism. have you taken a poll we are not aware of to factually prove this ?
The majority of Canadians , which by the way pierre, live outside of quebec and eastern Ontario, “do not ” agree with bilingualism. Just because a government, has as policy of official bilingualism “does not mean the majority of its citizens agree with such a policy”.
If it did, then a lot more than 17% of Canadians would be bilingual.
You also claim that bilingualism benefits everyone. Well, again , if that were a true statement, then I ask, why are ONLY 17% of Canadians bilingual ? They obviously think that bilingualism is NOT a Benefit them, because 83% of Canadians are”not ” bilingual.
When a jurisdiction, makes up 92% of an English population, as is the case in Ontario, it means that 92 out of every person in that jurisdiction is English. This statistic, alone means that there is simply No justification for any jobs to be designated as bilingual. If one requires service in french in such a jurisdiction, then translators will be provided. There is simply no NEED for bilingualism.
Please explain to me , as you quote the anglicisation of quebec. it simply is not the case. quebec has, will and always retain its culture and language. When has it not ? Again where is this the proof of this ? Where are you getting this from ?
As for assisting the Saskatchewan students, ok, when was the last time you assisted the English students in quebec, when their schools were “closing ” because they, as English students, became ineligible to attend these schools , and as a result, many sschools were forced to close.
If you knew what an open mind was, you would have no trouble agreeing with all that i have stated here.
Please SHOW ME THE PROOF
I’ll answer for Pierre:
a) In a 2006 poll, 81 % agree with bilingualism and when francophones only were questioned, 96%
http://www.radio-canada.ca/actualite/enprofondeur/desautels/bilinguisme/src-crop_bilinguisme.pdf
b) Out of the whole 10 provinces, Québec is the province that supports bilingualism more strongly. (91%)
http://www.radio-canada.ca/regions/alberta/2006/09/07/003-sondage-bilinguisme.shtml
c) 80 % of canadians want Canada to remain bilingual.http://www.pch.gc.ca/pc-ch/conslttn/lo-ol_2008/lord/index-fra.cfm
…enough said…
@PIERRE
No.
As to why people choose to hid behind an alter ego, if you wish, quite simply I cannot answer for anyone else Pierre. I would suspect however that it would be to avoid personal detection ( rather obvious ) but perhaps more precisely to save the embarrassment when proven wrong ( speaks to human nature ).
Personally being wrong has never been a concern of mine. I am more concerned with not learning and thus making the same error repeatedly. My full name Pierre is David Frederick Arthur Oldham. I am a resident of Cornwall, Ontario Canada, formally of Ottawa and previous to that a resident of Quebec.
Just to remain perfectly correct and clear Pierre, my intention was that we (us) CAN disagree and remain civil. On many issues taking into account minor errors and omissions we are in agreement in principle. Please read my reply to Highlander and you will understand the point that I make here. One does not always have to be in complete agreement to concede a point of view made and to respect or comprehend the reasoning behind the opinion.
Pierre the only thing I fear is time, not having enough to obtain answers to all the questions that have. When we stop seeking answers it is because our mind has closed to the notion that more questions remain unanswered. I love to debate, it brings about enlightenment. To answer your query regarding the continuance of our exchanges I have had to devote more time to other pressing matters recently so please do not take my absence as a lack of interest, enthusiasm or avoidance.
With regards to ” dirty tactics …” Pierre if you consider our exchanges and any responses to others that you have read of mine then you are more than equipped to answer that on your own. If I did not feel that you were a worthy opponent or someone that had something to contribute I quite simply would not have responded to your post to me.
With regards to language Pierre I admittedly struggle to learn other languages while my son has learned French and speaks without a noticeable English accent and has been encouraged to learn Cantonese next and not stop there.
And lastly, Pierre for my time for now is exhausted, you asked where I was in the seventies to defend the rights of the francophone to work for their Federal Government. I was a student who had the benefit of being friends with the only French speaking student at my suburban school.
The great myth about pierre, richard, and stella:
I believe that they are under the impression, that many of us here, because , the government has a policy of bilingualism, that we have to tow the bilingual line if you will. The constant in all of their rants, is that bilingualism, is something, we MUST ALL AGREE to, given that the government of Canada has made it policy, regarding hiring and practice. This is only not true, but as stats bear out, with only 17% of the population today that is bilingual, it is as Minister Moore said,a failed policy.
The “fraud squad” , have no clue, that Canada, is more than quebec, ( oops sorry )and eastern Ontario. If they took the time to travel throughout the rest of Canada, it would become clear that bilingualism is not only, not accepted, but loathed . There is no consensus for having a bilingual Canada, nor should there be.
Bilingualism, was the creation of the official languages act of 1969. It was never meant to be what it has evolved into today. it was meant to provide services in french “where numbers warrant” and NOT a wholesale blanketing of the country with an official bilingual policy.
If Canadians truly, from coast to coast embraced bilingualism then far more than a mere 17% would be bilingual. . So, no, there is simply NO JUSTIFICATION to have anything bilingual in Canada. If truth, be known, it would be far more justifiable to have some native languages deemed as inclusive in the bilingual family ,before the french would, or should be.
The french politicians from quebec, the nationalists that sit in the federal parliament, the francophones throughout eastern Ontario and the francophone groups, have all played a part, in intimidating the English politicians into doing what they want . Well, I believe that the tide is finally turning and it is being noticed, given that francophones are being asked to boycott this site, ia but one example.
People from all across Canada, are now being informed as to what the consequences of forced bilingualism are. the events in quebec, the cost of such a policy, the fact that hiring is now being geared to a bilingual policy , that in effect, means french only These are all having an effect on how millions of Canadians view this policy.
However, regardless, of these events. it is clear that quebec, will have to leave, sooner or later. I hope it is on Canada’s terms. Also, I have no fear of quebec leaving.. I feel in fact, that it would be beneficial to Canada, if quebec did leave. Certainly, spending three quarters of a trillion dollars since 1958 in transfer payments and grants would be beneficial to all Canadians. This is but one example.
The cost of bilingualism itself, estimated at between 3 to 4 billion a year would be another great saving.
BTW , richard, I never in my life said, oh, I am sorry I don’t speak french to anyone. I would NEVER EVER apologize for speaking the world’s most international language. To recall an English general, while on military conference in New York, along with a U.S general, a Canadian general and a french general, the french general said:
Why is it that at these conferences we always speak English ?
the English general said, ” It is because Canadian General, the U.S. general and Me, the English general, made it so YOU WOULD NOT BE SPEAKING GERMAN.
case closed, richard.
Link 1 – We need to see what the ACTUAL questions were. Page 26 lists 28% strongly agree being bilingual not necessary to work in Canada and 28% tend to agree as well for all of Canada, the numbers are a bit higher with just Anglophones.
Page 30 lists Quebecois wanting English taught in high schools -87% strongly agree and 10% tend to agree = 97% but Marois is not using this document
Link 2 – Support for bilingualism in Canada has increased according to a recent survey. study of the Decima commissioned by the Commissioner of Official Languages revealed that 72% of Canadians are in favor of bilingualism, in contrast to 56% three years ago. To the first time since the holding of such an inquiry, a majority of Anglophones (65%) is in favor of bilingualism. Quebec is the province that relies most heavily bilingualism: 91% of respondents are in favor. In Alberta, only 58% of the population supports the measure. Ontario, 66% of respondents are in favor of bilingualism. The survey was conducted in February 2000 among Canadians.
Link 3 -Take a look at section C proving a slant, dozens of Francophone groups were consulted to form this document that states – “the Government of Canada is committed to actively supporting linguistic duality in Canada.”
@ richard,
it is intersting that you have to speak for pierre, can’t he talk for himself ?
As for your polls. first off, they were conducted by a government wing, the french side of the state broadcaster the C.B. C. 7 years ago.
They cut no ice with me, given that as a entity, the ( C.B. C. french arm ) very existance depends on grants and subsidies from the government of Canada. this is the same government, that gives the C.B. C. its funding. Their polls are meaningless.
this is the same broadcaster that won’t publish the cost of official bilingualism to Canadians. To say there is a bias there is an
understatement. according to these stats, then far, far more Canadians would be bilingual, than 17 %, sorry this is just not accurate or crediable, nor does it have any common sense.It does not pass the smell test.
While speaking for pierre, maybe you would like to address my other issues that I brought up to him, since you have assumed the role of suragotte father.
Enough said.
@ Eric,
This is a far cry form what richard and his interruption of the poll actually means.
Thanks for this Eric. it is not hard to disprove anything the “fraud squad” claims. Polls, as you have aptly illustrated, can be very , very, deceptive, especially, when the questions are framed to soliciate a certain response. this is why I questioned richard as to the validity of the source, the french arm of the C.B.C. subsidised by the government.
Link # 1, without KNOWING the question, which means this is highly inaccurate, a full 56% feel bilingualism is not necessary.
it also states that a full 97% want english taught in quebec,
Link # 2, Taking into account Ontario and Albeta, only 62 % favor bilingualism. Agan, We don’t KNOW HOW the QUESTION was framed. or if a real definition of bilingualism was inserted prior to the poll being conducted.This was conducted in 2000.
Link # 3, This was clearly slanted and simply cannot be taken as accurate.
@ richard,
This illustrates to me, that the poll you hang your hat on, is extremely inaccurate. Perhaps if you travel across Canada, and spoke to people and gave them a clear definition of what bilingualism means, and the way it is applied, then I am confident that your “skewered” numbers would be greatly revamped.
it should be explained that bilingualism in Canada, “means french only ” not the traditional definition as English Canadians have come to know it by. This is what I meant when I said was there a clear definition what bilinguailsm means and HOW it is applied.
ON March 20, 2013 at 10:55 am Pierre wrote, “If, a German speaking state had been a part of the federation since before it’s conception, and had been one of it’s recognized founding people, of course, those Canadians would demand the same rights that the Québécois do. We would then, have three official languages, in Canada…”
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Oh my… That would just mean that the French and Quebec would have one more language to to ban and de-legitimize and another group of people to pick on.
Yikes, you guys would have your hands full already. I imagine you would then be demanding EVEN MORE tax money from the very Canadian citizens you are de-ligitimizing.
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Naw, enough is enough… We don’t need to bring another language and culture into this so the French can fear assimilation from and ba*&^sterdize them too.
Isn’t it bad enough that the Anglophones have been putting up with this cr@p for faarrrrrrr too long now already.
@ all
They are all gone, the boyctt is working, praise the lord
“The big deal Stella is that over and above the simple truth that language issues in Canada have been a divisive force on a world level we are the only nation that uses taxpayers dollars to fund a political party whose principal purpose is to sever governance ties
with its own country, a breaking of allegiance ( which by definition is a treasonous act ). That is a big deal Stella.”
Big high five to you for that one, David!
This I agree, is a huge deal!
Sorry Pierre,
Your latest rant towards me is asinine and obtuse. (You may have to google those terms to discover their definitions).
Most here will agree that your rants are nothing more/less than an attempt to elicit a likeminded response from me.
Because if I get upset it just gives you the opportunity to somehow try and validate what you attempt to do all the time; that is, to demonize my position and to further your attempt at my character assassination.
Case in point, when we address you guys it’s backed by facts, figures. Our stories are personal and when not personal such as the ones concerning violence being perpetrated by racial and ethnocentric behaviour by people in the province of Quebec, they are stories substantiated by researched and established journalists.
Just as a reminder. We (LFA) and supporters are not against any Francophone people. What we are against is bad government policies that favour one ethnicity over all others. And the result of all of these policies is a false elitist camp.
You Pierre and Stella and Richard and several others that post from time to time on this site attack us when we speak up against these policies that happen to favour the ethnicity for which you belong.
And so there it is. It’s odd that every single member of LFA and our supporters have suffered real, measurable loss that we can directly point to as being caused as a result of these failed bilingual policies. That’s right guys. Every single one of us has either not received a promotion, has lost out on a job, or have lost jobs simply for speaking out against all of this…
But yet you guys so vehemently defend this bilingual policy. For you, it is a new religion. Tell me guys, what have you personally got to lose if all of these bilingual laws/policies were suddenly halted in Eastern Ontario and French only this and that stopped in Quebec?
Have you personally ever lost a job due to bilingualism?
Have you personally ever lost out on a job due to bilingualism?
Have you personally ever lost out on a promotion due to bilingualism?
Have you personally ever had to leave your home province or the province of your birth due to suddenly becoming a second class citizen due to the language in which you communicate not being the ‘common’ language of the province?
Now ask yourselves these questions:
Have you ever personally ever received a job due to bilingualism?
Have you personally ever taken the position of someone who once held that same position simply because of the fact that you were bilingual and they were not?
Have you personally ever gained a promotion simply because you were bilingual.
And now, when asking yourselves these questions, please, if choosing not to be honest with me or the good readers of CFN; at the very least be honest with yourselves.
This is not meant as a call to war; nor should it be viewed as a callous nor crass or even uncouth set of questions directed towards you or yours.
The above commentary is about as honest as I can get with the lot of you without resorting to name calling, cursing or attacking.
@PETER
That was kind of funny !
@Eric
Yes, the link I provided is to a site that promotes the French language in Québec, in Canada and all over the world.
Concerned Francophone can post articles there.
The article, I wanted you(s) to read and answer the petition was named ”ÉCOLE FRANCO DE SASKATCHUWAN”.
I’ m sorry if I was not clear.
You can still go back, find it, read it and complete that petition if you care about francophone rights.
You all can!
Pierre
March 21, 2013 at 8:39 am
Yes Pierre spend another 10 million to support yet another school for less then 50 students.
I guess you would call that representation by population !
You still did not answer my question:
Why not a measurable, fair and equitable language services such as representation by population?
Do you believe in this?
You keep avoiding this question ,it a relevant and fair approach is it not?
peter
March 20, 2013 at 4:19 pm
The question to ask is do you believe in FRENCH bilingualism as there is many people thought Canada that are bilingual ,just not the Legislated language.
Do you believe french services should be allocated where numbers “DO NOT WARRANT” that may be a better question.
This question SHOULD be asked:
Should French language requirements surpass MERIT for job qualifications?
As this happens daily when applications are not even looked at if the applicant is not “DEEMED “bilingual,this completely disregards education and experience.
You see Mandatory bilingual in Canada means French language proficiency is more important then actually knowledge in that field.
@CORY CAMERON
Thank you Cory for noticing and providing feedback, it was appreciated.
@ S
David Oldham
You’re opinions and your attitude just resembled Stephen’s.
You are wrong, David.
The PQ does not use taxpayers money to promote souvereignty. That is paid for, by a special fund provided by separatists and party members.
Tax payer’s money is only used to govern.
That’s well documented and you can, check it out.
And, transfer payments are not a gift,
They are funds, that the federal collects and gives back to the provinces because they are the ones who provide the services.
And, I do not believe that language issues, in Canada, or in Québec, have been a divisive force, on a world level… I question your wording, on thas one.
Many countries have language laws.
Some Eastern European countries were reported to be studying Québec’s language laws because they wanted to copy them.
No other country, in the world, has language inspectors, though… That, I must admit, as been a source of embarrassement. Those, may soon be, a thing of the past.
The PQ’s quest for independance may be treasonous, in your opinion, but it is not. How many countries, and states, of the world, have had to fight for their independance? Most of them, dare I say?
The PQ, as others, Scotland, Catalonia, etc. is trying to do it, democratically.
As to my asking where you where in the seventies to defend the rights in the francophone to defend the rights of the francophone in the FPS… That bit of sarcasm was meant to all the posters.
You seem to be a caring individuel David. Please, follow that link that I have posted, March.19, 6:00 pm. Find the article intitled ”ÉCOLE FRANCO DE SASKATCHUWAN” (It’s written in both official languages). Please, complete the petition, to get those Francophone kids, in Saskatchuwan, a much needed school… It’s important.
@ Cory Cameron & edudyorlik
I’m very much willing to let readers decide what and who is asinine and obstuce between yourself (and edudyorlik, and Peter, and highlander) and myself.
Personnally, I think you(s) have got me beat, on that one… No contest.
But then, the readers of this blog may partial.
So, I’ll tell you what. If your aims to kill bilingualism, or to break up Canada ever prove to have been anything more, that a complete waste of time for a handfull of fear and hate mongers.
Then, I will admit that I, and my words, are asinine and obstuce.
And again, you have no facts to support your hateful rants… Just opinions.
CBC LIVE-Living English -The future of English culture in Quebec
http://www.cbc.ca/montreal/features/livingenglish/live/
Pierre
March 21, 2013 at 11:03 am
“So, I’ll tell you what. If your aims to kill bilingualism, or to break up Canada ever prove to have been anything more, that a complete waste of time for a handfull of fear and hate mongers.”
Pierre it is you that admitted that you are a separatist -therefore the breakup of the country -You certainly having a reading English deficit and for you to direct the majority of people posting here as fear mongers-Now We see you as the fear monger-er.
” But then, the readers of this blog may partial.”
But Pierre you not getting IT they represent the population,but go ahead call them fear mongers any other names there Pierre -its the last act of desperation of a debater to start name calling when one loses the argument.
@c……to answer all your questions……the answer is NO!! We were smart enough, took the initiative and knew ti was in our best interest to learn both official languages of this country…..FRENCH and english….la, comprends-tu?
peter wote: They are all gone, the boyctt is working, praise the lord
peter, we have a life. Sitting in front of a computer looking for videos and making you tubes is a total waste of time. Perhaps you should try getting a life, you would enjoy it.
@ pierre,
How about responding to my posts yesterday at 12:50 p.m and 2:02 p.m. or is richard trembly now speaking for you ?
I’d like to comment on your post today at 10:21 a.m.
You say that taxpayer money in quebec is used to govern , not for the P.Q, . well, the last time I looked the P.Q. was in power in quebec, and they are implementing bill 101 , an anti- English law.
They are also “using money ” to promote bill 14, another anti-English law.
You say language is “not divisive” ? really ? What about the hundreds and hundreds of protests, over language in this nation,
over the last 50 years. Why did the FLQ murder Pierre Lapote? Why was James cross kidnapped ?
Why were there two referendums ? Why/ Why ?? Why ?? and I can on for hours identifying languages “issues that were rooted in language division in this country”
Can you please name, and please provide “THE PROOF” , as you like ot say, the counties, in eastern Europe that want to “copy quebec’s language laws” ?? This ought to good.
If what quebec is doing is not treasonous, they just separate.
As for then Saskatchewan students, when was the last time you supported English students in quebec, regarding their education, since a full 70% of English schools were “forced to close” because of bill 101?
Please show me where you did anything ?
@ Cory
Thank you so much for your post this a.m. at 7:54
No one can add to what you have said, it was simply “excellent”
@ highlander,,
Also , a thank you as well. I also appreciate you bringing to my attention questions, that I have should have framed better.
Your accusations that “others” want to “kill bilingualism” and or ” break up Canada” Pierre are things that Quebec and the French have been doing since the first referendum.
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The English NEVER (i repeat NEVER) had a referendum to break up this country. WAKE UP PIERRE, you must be asleep. That was the Quebec and the French.
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If anything the English are fed up with what has been done to them and they are now starting to push back and suggest all the things Quebec and the French were the first to suggest.
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Heh, I can only imagine if it were the ROC and the English trying to hold a referendum to kick Quebec and the French out. They would never forget it.
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You think “je me souviens” has a deep seated resentful meaning? Phew…
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Anyways, i digress…
As for bilingualism, the only people/province that wants nothing to do with it is Quebec/the French.
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So once again we plainly see the attempt at the, oh so famous double speak technique which seems to be very popular with you and your ilk.
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Oh my… What on earth shall you do now Pierre.
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Proven wrong yet again… With conclusive video evidence.
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107 paid in out of 500 billion taken out. Hummm…
I’m pretty sure it’s safe to say that can be called “a gift.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1_NjmbbVHo&hd=1
But remember Pierre… Have a nice
video watching kinda day eh 🙂
stellabystarlight
March 21, 2013 at 11:47 am
‘We were smart enough, took the initiative and knew ti was in our best interest to learn both official languages of this country…..FRENCH and english….la, comprends-tu?”
So who is WE? are you talking for the rest of the country?
So NO to all these questions ?-Do you not work for the government?
So at least one of these questions would pertain to you!
Have you ever personally ever received a job due to bilingualism?
Have you personally ever taken the position of someone who once held that same position simply because of the fact that you were bilingual and they were not?
Have you personally ever gained a promotion simply because you were bilingual.
You do work for the government as an HR person ,right?
peter
March 21, 2013 at 12:42 pm
“Also , a thank you as well. I also appreciate you bringing to my attention questions, that I have should have framed better.”
Sir you framed yours just fine ,It was questions that I would have asked ,both of which are valid.
Thank you Peter for your insight and background Knowledge of the subject which is superior to mine yet far superior to Pierre and Richard .
I do not mention Stella as that would require me….lol well …lol … admit that stella …lol ..lol ,actually knew something …lol…lol on the mater.
Oh yes ****smile**** Doesn’t that make me feel better …lol…lol…, but seriously Stella….lol..lol..lol try doing a little research before you state what you do…lol…lol. *****smile*****
Oh yes have a nice day!
I appreciate your compassion Pierre in helping these kids from Sask. did you review my posting on it? Already existing space has been offered from the school board but the Franco group are concerned about assimilation instead of actual education. I can not in good conscience ask taxpayers in another province to make another building for a very people when space is available.
language police yet again:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=tREvvdJ4BT0
Now really is an É that’s to be added going to save the french language?
Rôtisserie St-Hubert restaurant franchise-but no issue with the language police for advertised “Hot Chicken Sandwich”
You guessed it ,It’s a Quebec corporation. see below
http://www.montrealgazette.com/opinion/Letter+chicken+sandwich+OQLF/8119388/story.html
So you say its isolated here is another incident with the language police:
http://youtu.be/jGuQxfo2ZnM
Highlander, here is another group that is “smart enough” as well.
http://www.thestarphoenix.com/news/national/Senate+reform+could+weaken+minority+language/8106597/story.html
It is the election of senators that concerns francophone groups. For instance, at-large elections could lead to a lack of francophone senators from the West, such as Manitoba’s Sen. Maria Chaput, an outspoken supporter of minority language rights, or Alberta’s Sen. Claudette Tardif, the deputy Liberal leader in the upper chamber. The Francophone federation has proposed ensuring that every province outside Quebec and territory has at least one seat dedicated to a French-speaking Canadian — but that isn’t in the Senate Reform Act.