Cornwall Council Losing Support
Cornwall City Council could NOT do a better job of losing support from those in the community. City Council has done a wonderful job of letting down so many in the community and this year’s budgeting process is no better!
Here is a short list of those who may feel slighted and/or left wanting more from our current Council and Mayor:
- Cornwall Community Hospital – We need an MRI machine and due to the large funding initiatives brought forward for the construction and renovation of the Hospital the community could not afford to give anymore. If council would have seen that the community was going to be affected by the recession and that the government was going to soon reduce transfer payments then it could have easily have afforded to support the hospital further by donating to ensure Cornwall gets an MRI machine! I love the Benson Centre but it blows my mind to see how much we spend on a hockey arena vs. health care! …But then again nothing surprises me with this council! This council has the potential to perform anywhere in between Amazing and WTF……unfortunately I find myself saying WTF far too often!
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- Language Fairness for All – Although I fully agreed with supporting the hospital and not for withdrawing or holding on to funds. Council could have communicated better and tried to find common ground and have supported both sides of the debate instead of one! Politically speaking these are very difficult times but nothing is impossible if believe and strive to achieve the goal! Sometimes getting involved behind the scenes and bringing two sides together is easier than you would have thought! However, staying neutral and doing nothing may reduce risk and work but you will be never become great unless you work harder than everyone else!
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- Cornwall Free News – after creating a special bylaw stating that it would not advertise with any on-line media firm who allows anonymous post; Cornwall continued to spend money with all its current media outlets but one (The Cornwall Free News); who allowed anonymous post! Why?
Only one logical reason would explain this action, the Cornwall Free News had placed articles and posted questions that highlighted or made the community aware of certain things the Mayor and Council wanted to hide behind closed doors!
- The General Public – Council Andre Rivette won a small battle vs. the rest of council and more importantly the Mayor by proving that the Mayor was out of line when he allowed councillors to attack him personally in a closed door meeting! The general public where angered and unfortunately not a single councillor other than Mr. Rivette even addressed the public.
Why, in an effort to remain transparent, where council and the clerk not informing the public of closed door meetings? Is this not mandatory or at least shouldn’t it be if you truly want to be transparent? Was this intentional and more importantly why? Should you be ostracized for asking these questions?
Why didn’t anyone on council make an attempt to respond – ex. “Council (I) would like to thank you for attending but unfortunately we cannot discuss any details at this time. We (I) would like to ensure you that we (I) are acting accordingly and cannot answer any direct questions to protect the integrity and relationships with all of those involved! When council has further information we will provide you with as much detail as possible!”……………………………Oh, wait I forgot! You would have to care and put some effort forward to do something as frugal as a proper media release! Wait don’t we pay someone to do this? Why are we paying someone to respond for our elected municipal councillors? Do they not get paid to perform as a politician? Can we cut costs by eliminating the position?
- Leslie O’Shaughnessy – Resigned after he could NOT deal with all of the scrutiny involved with so many closed door meetings……….or so we think! We were promised a reason from Leslie a long time ago but to this day Mr. O’Shaughnessy has not released anything! I respect his decision to step away from such a regressive council but he must realize his supporters deserve answers! Good Luck Leslie and I hope eliminating the work load and stresses of the position have improved your quality of life!
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- The Cornwall Community Action Group – Was formed by a leadership of Gerry Benson, Sandy Cameron, Dr. Michel Dubuc, Roy Perkins and a few others. The group claims that City Council has burdened the community with high taxes and claims that our community would benefit from a tax freeze or reduction in the tax levy. Currently we are going to see a big tax increase and despite the advertised tax rates we are paying more than the 2.9% advertise! A few years ago our average assessed home was near the $100,000 mark and now we sit around $160,000!
Due to increased assessments and continuous tax rate increases, the burden to the tax payer constantly rises unless the tax rate is decreased! Please do not be confused by this since it is very simple! Your assessed value of your home times the tax rate gives us your property taxes (not including education, water and other taxes)! If your house assessment continues to rise and the tax rate did not change (or saw a 0% rise – this is what would be advertised) you would still pay more in taxes!
Ex. 2010 – $100,000 (assessed home value) x .018 (Tax Rate) – $1,800
2011 – $120,000 (assessed home value) x .018 (Tax Rate) – $2,160
2012 – $140,000 (assessed home value) x .018 (Tax Rate) – $2,520
In a perfect world council would maintain and look for savings by holding division managers to tight budgets and ensure the community is not over burdened with taxes! Ensure our Seniors and less fortunate do not need to visit the AGAPE or use Ontario Works as frequently and continuously work to reduce the number of people on assistance by ensuring our quality of life and employment is better than any other community!
South Stormont vs. South Glengarry
Congratulations to South Glengarry for showing true brilliance! If there is no problem present then there is no need to address a negative and (for lack of a better term) useless proposal!
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Although, South Stormont had a different amendment they still didn’t catch such a clearly stated point in South Glengarry! Due to Robert’s Rules of Order you cannot reaffirm a current position and also negative positions such as “Not Mandate” are clearly out of order!
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Here is why: You cannot reaffirm a bylaw or position. What if it loses? Then you have a motion with no solution. A motion must be to make a change! Furthermore, it cannot bind future councils therefore cannot state what people cannot support! For example a sign bylaw can state dimensions and can state what languages it must be written in but cannot say that no future council can ever change the bylaw. Also, if there is no bylaw stating which language must be written on signs then you are FREE to do as you please!
Mr. Galganov wasted supporter’s money by not properly preparing nor presenting a suitable motion to council……………………..but really the only people upset with this:
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1) The Hospital Protesting Language Activist and
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2) Everyone else because we are sick of hearing this small group complain about Quebec and other counties!!!!! Stick to our current issues and trying to provide valid solutions to improve our community!
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Change the things you feel are wrong by going to those communities and stop wasting tax payers dollars by tying up our Council’s who obviously have more important things to do after coming out of a recession and staring a potential new one in the face!
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Thank You,
Mike Bedard
(Comments and opinions of Editorials, Letters to the Editor, and comments from readers are purely their own and don’t necessarily reflect those of the owners of this site, their staff, or sponsors.)
Ditto admin!!! It’s funny how some say they are against forced bilingualism and in favour of freedom of expression and then say if you choose to be bilingual we’re going to organize a boycott against you. RETARDED. Why can’t we deal with real problems? I’ve seen unfair bilingualism requirements lets work on those things.
@ Admin
Touche,
However, in the meantime people have to live NOW
How do you rectify ,or bring attention to the hundreds many be thousands of people who are barred from working because of the bilinbgual policies?
What do yuo say to students and newly graduated people, sorry ,you still have to pay your student loans, but you can’t work because you cannnot pass a french test,in a community where the VAST majority of people are English
I lived in quebec for over 45 years, I saw what appeasment does. It makes them want MORE and MORE , there is no compromise in their vocabularily.
look at Ottawa, consevatives elected, nothing changes, try to talk to governement officials, they won’t even listen.
Yet, we want to be within the law. Lets face it, other than mass revolution we don’t have a lot of choice, unless you can come up with immediate suggestions to thwart a very disturbuing problem
my real take, help the P.Q. win a majority and get them out of Canada, this will happen eventually anyway, so lets control the agenda and have a 10 year moritorum on separation , at the end of ten years they are gone
Within that timeframe iron out all issues that concern a nine province Canada and have them go.
Then the need for any type of bilingualism in canada would be moot.
people are really fed up and at their wits end here.
SPera if people are really unhappy they should protest. They should write letters to the editor; go to public meetings and protest. You have to give the Cameron’s and their supporters credit for standing up for what they believe in and logging the hours in all weather.
Not every one is a slick politician. We’re too used to media only carrying pabulum.
Real people speaking honestly is something we truly rarely ever here.
Bottom line is if you want change you have to “Be the Change.” That means hard work; not just arguing back and forth.
Well John what’s your position? How would you fix unfair bilingualism requirements?
that’s retarded Bella! 🙂 I’m so politically incorrect and then people send me emails chastising me! “You shouldn’t say retard!” lol
Yes I would Admin, and from day one I’ve acknowledged that unfair requirements exist. But I support Canada being officially bilingual, my Canada includes Quebec and I don’t support the many extreme positions that have been advocated by some people here. The movement was originally about fair hiring practices but has since diverged into completely different areas and has picked up militant extremists. As a result the movement has lost a lot of credibility.
John Macdonald
January 18, 2013 at 2:49 pm
“The movement was originally about fair hiring practices but has since diverged into completely different areas and has picked up militant extremists. As a result the movement has lost a lot of credibility.”
The same thing could be said about the quiet revolution in Quebec ,yet they had the FLQ and 160 bombings and 8 murders later those same terrorist are considered hero’s in some social settings.
As with any Social movement some people take on extreme positions ,in saying that Quebec still got their quiet revolution despite those horrendous acts by the FLQ yet most Quebecers did not agree with the FLQ’s approach.
Some have more extreme views then others, but militant’s true term is ready to fight ;combative and I do not feel those posting on here fall into that definition.
To reaffirm, LFA remains advocating for fair government hiring policies ,where MERIT is always first and if bilingualism is required then it should be representation by population.
This can be a measurable outcome and still provide those services needed ,LFA has never advocated for no french services.
@ John
So john, if your canada includes quebec, then what you are saying is that you are in agreement with current quebec laws eg. bill 101 ,is that correct sir?
Because these laws will NEVER be changed
you are in agreement that Englsih schooling will be further curtailed against anglophones, as well as other rectrictions against the English . So you agree with that as well sir?
saying you are in favor of official bilingualism and in the same breath saying you want quebec in canada with its anti- English and anti-democratic laws, is a contradiction sir.
No one is against the french, what we are opposing is loss of choice in freedom of expression sir.
When a township ,such as russell FORCES ONE TO PUT UP AN ENGLISH OR french sign, it takes away choice sir,
Similar to the quebec laws WHICH FORCES french ONLY
If quebec allowed the posting of English sign and french signs and any other languages’ signs, then the choice is there and freedom of expression woulsd exist.
but it dosen’t, you can’t even publish a 1 page bulletin in a local community paper in English. And you want these types of laws in a Canada that includes quebec?
If so, then you should embrace this and move there.
I do not want to have any jurisdiction in canada to have these laws on the books and are enforced by langiage police.
If you do, well john , your political stripes have been exposed
There is no bilingualism in quebec, if there were, we not be discussing this issue at all.
But bilingualism has come to mean frecnh ONLY , there is no English, in the eyes of the powers that be, its that simple.
@ Admin
I am a member of CLF. I have forwarded edudyorlik’s and highlander’s videos to members of parliament as well as friends all over Canada
No responses. I have emailed and sent letters, again no responses.
They (MP`S) do not want to touch or even comment on anything that has to do with bilingualism
I am 68 years old and lived in montreal until 1984
I witnessed first hand the bombings, the FLQ, the 1970 FLQ crisis, the referendum 1980, I was MTL in 1995 for the second referendum.
Anglo grouops and parties ,alliance quebec and the equality party have been twarted at each and every turn by the FEDERAL government in their quest ot bring equal justice to the English in quebec.
Take a look at the videos posted here by edudyorlik and highlander
Please do not say to me ,BE THE CHANGE, no one has worked harder. i was a past member of these anglo organizations. I licked envelopes, sent our mail and like for 50 years.
I ma stil active, despite health issues, sir
We got NOWHERE FROM THE FEDS or ANYONE ELSE.
This is not a silly little English ,french thing .
It is about FUNDAMENTAL RIGHTS OF ALL CITIZENS.
The federal government almost dares you to revolt, by putting people in an impossible corner. look at the three judges who agreed with the section (2B) of the charter and then turned ariound and said it didn`t matter because the french cause was right
Are you kidding me, when judges say they can arbratrairly be above the law, then please tell me sir, WHAT`S left to do
This ruling is a slap in the face to every Canadian soldier that died and fought for the cause of freedom for all
Spera protest starts small. For example with Beavergate here in Cornwall we petitioned the city for a 90 day Moratorium which escalated from there.
If step one doesn’t work then connect with like minded people and then keep the ball rolling until you come to a position you can live with.
If you stop trying then stop complaining. The system really works if you work the system. The problem is most groups defuse themselves and lose sight of their goal.
People don’t know how to protest anymore; especially young people…
And for those that point to the Red Flag student thing in Montreal it was a front for the PQ. See, those old radicals made it work for them and nearly got a majority to boot.
Protest does work.
Alliance Quebec was once a reputable and influential anglophone rights organization. Then it was taken over by the extremists and self destructed, which is a real shame. If you lobby politicians to take extremist positions don’t be surprised if you are ignored. Even Hudak, who has taken some very risky policy positions, won’t touch much of what is espoused on here with a ten foot pole. Harper now supports a requirement that the officers of parliament must be bilingual because throughout his career he has continually shifted his position on bilingualism to a moderate middle.
@ admin
Were you part of quebec`s language protests of the 1960`s 1970`s and 1980`s
Do you know who Keith Henderson,William Johnston and Eric Maldolf are
Not only did we protest and and challengae the laws, we backed them up daily visist to OLF . there are no complaints here, only what we did, and in response to your condecending remarks that only you know how to do it.
well, if you are so adept at successful protests, then you can come in and give the CLF a talk on how , to be successful using your methods, I would go to that myself.
Also, I am not retarded, I am a senior who has fought a life long battle in the best way I know how to get the equality and fairness, ALL CITIZENS have aright to expect.
As a journalist to call people names , is unprofessional and you are doing to me, what you have told people on these posts not to do.
I hope you have the courtesy to post my blog, you certainly did not hestitate to publically insult and hurt me.
@ Spera. Unfortunately for you and your group, the bilingualism issue isn’t a big deal to the vast majority of Canadians. Even the Harper Cons, who hate everything the Liberals ever did, don’t see any political advantage to changing or abolishing Official Bilingualism. My guess is that 99% of the people involved in your cause live in close proximity to the Quebec border where services are provided in both languages.
@ John
I was a member of Alliance quebec. Can you please specify what the radical elements of our organization were
Was it the position of having equality of language as Canadian citizens.
Was it having a proportionate amount of money for English education
was it to have signage in conformity with the supreme court of canada`s ruling
was it to have the right to display signage on businesses, given we pay the same amount of taxes as all other groups in quebec.
was it to apply Canadian law with respect to the Charter of rights and freedoms that were denied by an illegal bill 101 prior to 1982 sir.
please John I would very much like to hear the radical ideas of an organization that I was a member of, please go into detail , this will be extremely educational to me, since I was there
FYI John, the Equality parties platform that was not part of the TV debates when they ran candidates, was adopted as part of the CLARITY AT BY CHRETIEN
Some of these same equality party ideas came from ALLIANCE QUEBEC The radical group you alluded to sir.
Also john, had it not been for bill 22, which is the foundation for bill 101 , and its passing by bourassa , there never would have been a bill 101
@ John
I almost forgot, Peter posted today at 3:48 p.m.
I thought he made some good points.
I would like very much to hear you take on his post.
I am looking forward to your response, if you do respond, to having quebec as part of canada given thier current laws, and at the same time , favoring bilingualism
I would love to be educated on these issues to differenciate between the two
Spera I lived in Quebec during Alliance Quebec’s hey day. The problem has always been that not enough of the public stepped up. They didn’t get angry enough. They just moved.
It’s sad, but there was a hopelessness and there was still good will about having to balance things out and that things got better. Those of us that knew better I’m sure take no satisfaction in being right.
If you don’t learn from History you are doomed to repeat it. You can never pacify a fascist and Quebec Separatism has always tasted of Fascism and Racism.
Admin didn’t call you names. He said your boycott idea is retarded. And it is!
@ admin
My point exactly. there is no viable solution. So, have them separate. as a canadian I do not want to be part of any racist or facist society, and HAVE TO PAY FOR IT
To be honest, there is nothing Canadian about quebec. there is no advantage to having quebec in canada.
As for appeasement, the anglos were repeatedly told, for the SAKE OF SOCIAL PEACE , we must lie down and be quiet,
So many did. there was NO LEADERSHIP FROM OTTAWA where they could have acted. keep in mind the radicals ,up to this day, run quebec.
Ottawa ignored the anglos, and let us drown, in the name of social peace.
Why one word TRUDEAU
So now what is left. If people actively take up arms or get radical , then they loose, its that simple.
It is my opinion that quebec is lost. its only a matter of time before they win another referendum.
It is for this reason, that the only vialble solution is for Canada to have a referendum on wheather we want quebec in or out of canada
if you think this is far fetched, well in 1950, no person anywhere in canada would have believed what Canada has evolved into what it is today, would they
quebec will go, but I would rather it Canada`s terms.
peter wrote: There is no bilingualism in quebec, if there were, we not be discussing this issue at all.
I have friends that live in Ville Lasalle who are unilingual english and have no problems whatsoever. They have good paying jobs and are not bothered by this language issue at all.
I truly believe that there is a gross exageration by the english freedom fighters when it comes to language and occurences in Montreal.
peter…this is Ontario, the majority of Canadians don’t care about Quebec politics….except the english freedom fighters which are not the majority of this country. Let Quebec deal with their own problems.
@ ed
yes you are probably correct.
BUT, I travel and have businesses, and many, many people are being made aware of quebec and her racist laws.
Today, we live in a Global world. not like in the 50`s ,60`s 70`s 80`s and so on. the net has brought the world much closer together, there is something to be said about the INFORMATION HIGHWAY
Canadians too, are aware of what happens in quebec.
we are also a far more educated society than we have ever been.
So, yes, for now ,you are correct.
But, I can relate many stories, that can be verified , of Canadians, west of prescott that are more and more leaning to quebec separation as never before .
these people pay Canadain taxes and are not happy paying for quebec and forced bilingualism. It amay not be an issue now, but in the future, well, it will become one.
especially in light of quebec`s recent election and inflamatory laws it plans to pass.
There are many US firms that are getting fed up fast. The current lawsuit filed on behalf of GAP,OLD NAVY , BEST BUY, WAL-MART concerning the signage they use in quebec.
These are giants, and it would not take too mch to have them pack up and leave. Companies such as these talk to each other and then some .
Word can get out very, very fast, particularly when it comes to giant US firme, who have no compunction to leave in a heartbeat
So, ed. its only a matter of time.
Not only is the boycott retarded, it is childish, harmful and useless.
Taking pride in your senseless actions and bragging about empty parking lots is a disgrace. Taking your frustrations out on any business is pathetic and shameful.
spera
January 18, 2013 at 4:31 pm
“Look at the three judges who agreed with the section (2B) of the charter and then turned ariound and said it didn`t matter because the french cause was right”
“Are you kidding me, when judges say they can arbratrairly be above the law, then please tell me sir, WHAT`S left to do”
Well Spera here is the PROOF of what you say -take a look people be informed of Canada’s reality -the question is for what interest groups do these Judges violate the charter for?
who is really is in control?Certainly not the people through legislation!
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/whistleblower-prompts-call-for-more-debate-on-whether-bills-violate-charter/article7449909/?utm_source=Shared+Article+Sent+to+User&utm_medium=E-mail%3A+Newsletters+%2F+E-Blasts+%2F+etc.&utm_campaign=Shared+Web+Article+Links
@ john
Perhaps you would be better off responding to Peter`s post today at 3:38 p.m.
yes when one calls an idea retarded it implies the person who suggested the idea is retarded. THis is the same admin who admonished others for doing the exact same thing as he did.
Perhaps you can educate us by responding to the questions posed by Peter, as alluded to above, and share your vast experinces in that which you claim to be so adept
It all boils down to a VERY simple fact.
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The English in this country are being taken for a ride.
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Our apathy complacency and general sense of being fair and nice has turned out to be our downfall and NOW we must wake up and smell the coffee and realize that it’s NOT about bilingualism and the idea fallacy of this country being able to speak both languages.
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The proof for that is staring us right in the face.
QUEBEC — Bill 101 — NO ENGLISH — yet the French are forcing EVERYONE else to learn French WHY?
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So that Canada can become an ALL French nation. Bilingualism is a HUGE lie, an illusion, a rouse to make everyone think that it’s so wonderful to KNOW other languages. And again, if it’s so wonderful to know other languages then why are the French so opposed to the English language (and the Canadians flag i might add) in Quebec. Even their medical ambulance people refuse to speak English. C’mon people.
WE ALL KNOW THE ASWER yet we continue to pretend along with them.
STOP this insanity. PLEASE WE MUST realize that there is a means to an end in the grand scheme of things and believe your own gut feelings when they tell you that the means to an end in this situation — is not a nicy nicy wonderful coexistence — with a group of people who as soon as they get the larger numbers in whatever area they “invade” take no time at all to turn whatever area those larger numbers happen to be in COMPLETELY FRENCH ONLY.
Bilingualism is code for FRENCH ONLY.
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PS: knowing other languages IS a great and wonderful thing.. WHEN ONE IS NOT FORCED TO…
And also when it is added to the concept of a culture that believes THEY ARE BETTER and deserve to take over a country.
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Oh and here is Januarys video.. Enjoy..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3CMpi8TxCU
Oh and all you English people in Quebec.. Don’t forget, Marois said it herself, “Your rights will be FULLY protected.” Course, you didn’t have any to begin with so she can indeed claim that is a true statement. Play on words just like SOME here.
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—-ooO-(_)-Ooo——-
Ed
January 18, 2013 at 5:14 pm
@ Spera. Unfortunately for you and your group, the bilingualism issue isn’t a big deal to the vast majority of Canadians.
Proof Ed back something you say for once with facts!
“Even the Harper Cons, who hate everything the Liberals ever did, don’t see any political advantage to changing or abolishing Official Bilingualism.”
Well Ed/furtz change is very rarely abrupt ,as for bilingualism its insidious and pervasive in the government since now 65% of ALL government employee’s are bilingual (french).
But change is coming ,no question of that thank you social media and internet ,the voice of the people can no longer be controlled through government and their media patsies .
@ ed
You are probabably correct, but there is a growing number of people west of Prescott that are tuning in here.
Remember, Ed, this is not the 1950, 1960, 1970 or 1980, our world today is global.
the internet has changed everything. Today, as you know, we have INSTANT information. more and more people are becoming very aware of quebecès poliies and laws, and dont like it.
Today people are better educated as well.
As a businessman, I travel and see and get a feel for people and how they view such issues.
Many Canadians are acutely aware that they are paying huge amounts in taxes for bilingualism and quebec transfer payments that they simply reject.
Add to that, the massive court case involving some pretty high steppers in the retail industry. WAL-MART BEST BUY GAP and OLD NAVY, are currently going to court over language issues in quebec.
These are companies with large tentacles and have no compunction to leaving quebec in a heartbeat.
So ed, the word is getting out on not only bilingualism ,but the language laws , and how they must adapt and the costs involved here. They also reflect on how Canada has failed to deal with this issue.
The world is truly watching,because we dont hear about it, does not mean that it is not happening.
@ John
Perhaps you should address Peters post today at 3:48 today
as well as mine at 5:18 P.M.
FYI anyone that suggests that an idea is retarded implies as well that the person saying it is retarded as well.
I would like to know you reponses to the posts above.
I would love to be educated by one who is so adept at claiming they know vasts amounts of information, without a basis in fact.
What was it, you want a bilingual canada , but you also want quebec in Canada, and quebec is not bilingual-correct
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What exactly were the radical views of ALLIANCE quebec, I was a member, so please, feel free to educate me, or perhaps contradict what I posted today at 5:18
look forward to it.
admin
January 18, 2013 at 5:45 pm
“If you don’t learn from History you are doomed to repeat it. You can never pacify a fascist and Quebec Separatism has always tasted of Fascism and Racism.
So very well said Admin:
Jamie the similarities and the relative recent history of another Fascist regime that started in Germany in the 1930’s .
Many sat back and watched as the increasing alienation of their neighbors ,friends and it only got worse from there .
The rumors were there of the atrocities ,yet the population denied it happened they believed the propaganda,and the oppression and the atrocities continued unabated .
When the regime ended those neighbors and friends were gone and the population was shocked of where alienation of a religious group had lead to hatred and those atrocities.
Fascism with ethnocentrism in society will only lead to human suffering.
Jamie where do you honestly see this going ,I’M curious how do you think this will evolve with Quebec and Canada ,as well as the these said issues with equality /language.
@ spera. Do you really want to break up one of the most successful democracies on the planet because services are provided in English and French, or that four municipalities in Ontario, near the Quebec border have bilingual business signs? That’s nuts. And that’s why you and your cause is not taken seriously by most Canadians.
As I’ve said before, if I was all bent out of shape because of bilingual signs and living in a community with a significant Francophone population, I’d move a little further away from the Quebec border.
@ John admin asked “Well John what’s your position? How would you fix unfair bilingualism requirements?” John This is the same question I put out to many times. You never answer that question.
@ Spera
“How do you rectify ,or bring attention to the hundreds many be thousands of people who are barred from working because of the bilinbgual policies?
“What do yuo say to students and newly graduated people, sorry ,you still have to pay your student loans, but you can’t work because you cannnot pass a french test,in a community where the VAST majority of people are English”
Wow Spera does that sound familiar…couldn’t agree with you more.
@ Admin I agree with letter writing and protesting too and many many letters have been written, but in whose drawer are all these letters sitting in today.
Of course your letters gather dust. You guys write things like comparing modern Germany to Nazi Quebec. That’s totally shameful and insulting. You want some advice on ensuring fair hiring practices? Quit saying WACO things. You guys are your own worst enemies. You use derogatory names to refer to Quebec, use extreme and insulting analogies, advocate actions that are nothing short of outright bigotry, etc etc etc. I hate to break this to you, but there’s no evidence of a rise in support for your beliefs. None. Indeed, you guys continually alienate the moderate middle.
@ stella
Oh, but it is ok not to have English cards in a jean cotu
I see
now if shoppers drug mart refused to have have french cards on sale, saying oi was an English store , How would you react stella?
Not only should they be boycotted, but they should be CHARGED with discrimination as well
ON January 18, 2013 at 2:49 pm
John Macdonald wrote, “from day one I’ve acknowledged that unfair requirements exist. But I support Canada being officially bilingual, my Canada includes Quebec and I don’t support the many extreme positions that have been advocated by some people here.”
Well John, having come from a family situation with a father who was English and a mother who was 100% French Canadian, I started out like just you say you are now (course I was in my teens and didn’t know a lot at the time. NOT that I know a lot now 🙂 ). But, I did believe in the ideal of bilingualism. I believed Trudeau when he said, “all we are asking is that we provide services — in French — within the federal government to our fellow French Canadian citizens. This,” Trudeau went on to say, “will help the French truly feel part of this country.”
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I agreed with this ideal. And I truly believe that most Canadians (including most Anglophone Canadians at that time) felt this way as well. They believed this was fair and equitable way to do things. They were basically, “OK with this concept.”
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Then, this is where that so called “unfair treatment” and “unfair actions” on the part of the French began to creep into the picture. We went from offering services as was mentioned already in the federal government on through all the steps which we all know (so I don’t have to name them ALL here) Suffice to say, we went through the FLQ, then progressed on through Rene Leveque, the two referendums (which btw was a real slap in the face for the rest of Canada basically being told in no uncertain terms that our fellow Canadians wanted no part of the ROC) but, none the less we STILL wanted to “make nice” with the French and Quebec none the less – I can only imagine if that were completely the other way round with Canada wanting to get rid of the French at that time – Holleeee jumpin).
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Then, things progressed on through various discriminatory laws (22, 178, 101) in Quebec Etc etc etc. We watched Quebec systematically begin to treat our fellow Canadians like dirt while the federal government DID NOTHING. Which brings us to just about what we see today in Quebec where the Quebec government is basically providing the cookie template to it’s French ONLY citizens as to how to treat their fellow English Canadian citizens that still live among them (the ones that didn’t leave when Quebec tried to make life so difficult that they thought they all would leave) like dirt and with disrespect (there are TONS of examples of this) and the average people are simply following along through with what their government is condoning with full impunity and without opposition.
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AND THIS my dear fellow poster here on CFN is WHY… I (and I believe most Canadians in general) now feel that what started out as perhaps a great concept and gesture (bilingualism) has been hijacked and abused SO EXTREMELY badly by the French that what began as the idea of Canada being officially bilingual has now left such A BAD TASTE in peoples mouth that they WANT NOTHING TO DO WITH IT or the people who are trying to “force it” down their throats.
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AND, don’t forget, those same people who are doing the forcing (the French) are also the same people who want NOTHING TO DO with bilingualism in their own back yard. So you can BET this plays into the whole negative sentiment also, BIG TIME.
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So in the end John, there is some background and some provocative elements connected to those “extreme positions that you mention that some people here and in Canada TODAY might have right now. These negative feelings were not just dreamt up out of nothing or nowhere. These were NOT positions that they came to this party with. They are positions that were (like seedlings) planted, and coddled, and watered and given all the ingredients that were necessary for them to grow into the the immensely negative feelings that we see now towards “bilingualism” and everything it entails.
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In other words, if there are extreme positions that exist right now, they are indeed — a REACTION to — events that took place AND ARE taking place which point directly back to Quebec the French and how they abused the good will and good nature that was extended to them at a time when the English majority REALLY DIDN’T have to do such a thing.
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Thus, they HAVE NO ONE ELSE to blame but themselves because, —
within their desire to save their language and culture at all costs (including putting down and crushing other peoples languages and cultures)
— they went (and are going) WAY TOO FAR).
And before you say, that’s’ exactly how it was before the pendulum swung. I offer this.
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That “MAY” be true on some level and to some degree BUT… It is indeed one thing for the majority (who also happen to be the victors in the war) to do as they please (good or bad, that is just a natural state) but for the minority to be pushing the majority around for a cause that only benefits said minority? Well, as you can see resentment accumulates right quick.
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Oh and PS: If it were not bad enough that the French have FRENCH ONLY EVERYTHING (don’t bother saying that’s not true cause it’s only semantics) in the province of Quebec. They are now also exporting these draconian ways to Ontario (and of course New Brunswick) with their FRENCH ONLY medical clinics and school busses etc.
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And ya know… This simply WILL NOT DO.
Why? Because the days of living with a mentality that said, “we only serve whites” has long past and rational decent societies have taken over. We have moved (or at least we thought so) to more fair and inclusive systems. And though these “French only” clinics (in of all places ONTARIO) have not been properly challenged to now, THEY DAMN WELL SHOULD BE and ONE DAY, no doubt — WILL BE —
Oh and Ed RE: January 18, 2013 at 7:39 pm POST
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Ed wrote, @ spera. Do you really want to break up one of the most successful democracies on the planet because services are provided in English and French, or that four municipalities in Ontario, near the Quebec border have bilingual business signs?”
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NO, of course not ed. Not on those grounds, by no means.
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I find it so quaint how you simplified that Ed. NICE.
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BUT… Yes, we would — AND SHOULD — break up this democracy and get rid of the French drain on it. If for no other reason than the French have somehow decided that — in their nick of the woods — it’s French only while believing it’s OK to push everyone else to be both. How can that be justifiable on ANY level. Talk about vanity… Quebec ALREADY acts as if it is it’s own separate country anyways. The only part they ever so cleverly neglected to alter was the sucking sound we hear of our majority tax dollars being constantly sucked out of the ROC.
– So, buuuhhh bye… It’s time for the teen to leave the basement and cut off the allowance.
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Oh but remember – Have a nice day eh… 🙂
Ed
January 18, 2013 at 7:39 pm
“Do you really want to break up one of the most successful democracies on the planet because services are provided in English and French, or that four municipalities in Ontario, near the Quebec border have bilingual business signs?”
Are you really that slow minded or was this your form of propaganda?
Break up -wow you must think our group is a powerful entity -thanks for the credit but no Canada will remain intact.
We do not have a bilingual country -2 official languages of which one is NOT recognized in Quebec.
The people are not upset at bilingual signs but the propensity of our government to push french rights in every part of the country -yet not protect English rights in Quebec?
Rosie
January 18, 2013 at 8:06 pm
@ Spera
“How do you rectify ,or bring attention to the hundreds many be thousands of people who are barred from working because of the bilinbgual policies?
Millions of people only 17% of the population is bilingual -THAT’s 29 million people .
So is these policies in the interest of the average citizen -clearly NO,in fact it discriminates against the average citizen.
Rosie
January 18, 2013 at 8:06 pm
” Admin I agree with letter writing and protesting too and many many letters have been written, but in whose drawer are all these letters sitting in today.”
The question is do the letters actually get to those intended or the pre-screeners in the interest of their language filing them under garbage-remember 65% of the government is french bilingual.
Highlander you combine your efforts. If one area of pressure doesn’t work you add more pressure and build more allies. You have to stay focused and committed. It doesn’t mean you’ll get what you want, but it sure improves the chances.
John pens:
“Of course your letters gather dust. You guys write things like comparing modern Germany to Nazi Quebec.”
Quebec will get worse though John before it gets better as will Ontario and the rest of Canada. And I’m beginning to think that if the Nazi regime were around today, they would be taking lessons from Quebec and not vice-versa.
For we have a racist, ethnocentric government currently in power in Quebec; much like Nazi Germany was in the 1930’s. Laws were instituted severely restricting the rights of the Jewish minority at the time. Hymmm, this sounds something like Bill 101 and the rest of it. We have (for the most part) a populace who democratically voted the PQ in – much like the Nazis were.
But there is a difference here. People, politicians and leaders of the civil service who possess French ethnocentric ideologies are taking over Canada without having fired a shot. Nazi Germany, on the other hand, did much the same but were less civil about it. Instead of peppering the populace with grandiose speeches, practicing charisma and charm and the leader decked out with fancy suits with Red Roses tucked in the lapel; Nazi Germany’s leader came around with a Roman Emperor’s salute and a flair for military machinery and might.
Sooooooo, the only difference between the two are the methods used. The results are the same.
Cory
Godwin’s Cory and a very poor analogy…
How so, admin?
I think I’m drawing some similarities here?
Here you go Cory. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law
“Godwin’s law does not claim to articulate a fallacy; it is instead framed as a memetic tool to reduce the incidence of inappropriate hyperbolic comparisons. “Although deliberately framed as if it were a law of nature or of mathematics, its purpose has always been rhetorical and pedagogical: I wanted folks who glibly compared someone else to Hitler or to Nazis to think a bit harder about the Holocaust,” Godwin has written.”
Thanks Jamie,
I had known what Godwin’s law was and what it implies.
My simile in comparing contemporary Quebec with Nazi Germany I write with absolutely no ill will nor downplay of what Jewish people encountered in the Holocaust. To compare that with what English speaking Quebecers are experiencing or did experience I suppose is like comparing a scratch to a full blown infection. But alas, at the beginning that full blown infection started off as just a scratch………
We need to ask these questions from both our kith and kin in this country:
1) Have minority English Rights within the Province of Quebec been reduced in the last 30 years? And if so, why? If a minority populace within Quebec is being treated in this unfair manner than what in the hell justifies this? I would argue nothing. The English speaking people in Quebec are being treated as such just because they are English; nothing more, nothing less.
2) Why are English speaking people in Canada being denied jobs simply because of a language they don’t speak; all of this within the country of their birth and a country who’s majority is made up of English speaking people to begin with?
3) At what point are the Canadian people going to realize that this policy of turning a blind eye or following this policy of appeasement only makes things worse for them?
If the policy of equality between practicioners of both French and English speaking peoples were the issue – then this whole problem would have been solved by the providing of both English and French services by government institutions to begin with.
The problem now lies where one province is trying to stifle the English language completely off the map through unfair laws impacting all facets of life for the minority population there and this mindset is now impacting the provinces bordering this province.
Ontario:
French only school buses/schools
French only Health care centres
French only social service organizations
Bilingual mandated (take a look at what this means in Russel Township) signs
Bilingual listed jobs now outnumber jobs with no language ‘requirements’
How does an English parent explain to his/her child why they cannot ride the school bus with their French friends as what is happening in Alexandria?
How on Earth is an English parent supposed to explain Xenophobia and ethnocentrism to young kids?
And how do those same kids not develop guilty feelings of having done something wrong to elicit these actions to begin with?
How do young French kids in turn view their English counterparts when their adult parents (whom they’re told to trust implicitly) tell them it isn’t right to ride the bus anymore with the English kids?
All of this is nothing but socially engineered hate.
I believe Edudyorlik’s brilliant statements in this blog of January 19, 2013 at 2:35 am sums it up best.
Cory
OMG Cory. The laws restricting Jews in Nazi Germany are absolutely nothing like what’s happening to anglophones in Quebec. Not even close. For you to state that the government in power in Quebec is much like the Nazi regime is sickening. You’ve obviously lost all sense of perspective on this. Either that or you don’t understand what happened to various groups of people in Nazi Germany in the 1930s, most notably the Jews but also others labelled subhuman.
Cory it’s just not cool to use one of the largest atrocities ever committed on this planet to compare a bunch of punk separatists. Godwin’s law in many ways means you lose.
Focus Focus Focus 🙂
@ John Macdonald. And that is one of the reasons the freedom-fighter’s “movement” isn’t taken seriously. They have no discipline regarding their public statements. It’s one thing to have crazy ideas, but quite another thing to express them out loud.
Cory comparing modern Quebec and Nazi Germany:
“Sooooooo, the only difference between the two are the methods used. The results are the same.”
No Cory. The results are not in any way the same. Not even close. Dude, you have serious issues.
Ed fair employment is not crazy. What CCH and the government are doing is wrong. There is a HUGE difference between offering bilingual service and forcing nearly the entire work force to achieve and pass high proficiency French exams. Exams that native French speakers themselves have trouble passing!
@ Eduyorlik
your comment at 2:35, perfect….or as the Scots would say “Teesh”.
John why do you criticize so much? Have you written any letters yet? You agree there is a problem with unfair hiring practices. You admit that. Why don’t you give it a shot. Your help would very much be appreciated and I mean that.
Admin. I’m not saying there isn’t an issue with unfair hiring practices. They should stick with that issue instead of squawking about bilingual signs and making bizarre comparisons to Nazi Germany, and booting Quebec out of Canada.