advising Council to vote not to vote on resolution
CFN – After reading CAO Derik Brandt’s report online late last week, it was no surprise that last night South Glengarry Council opted not to follow in the footsteps of South Stormont Council in pledging never to violate Canadians’ inalienable and Charter Freedom of Expression with regard to choice of language on signs.
In November, human rights activist Howard Galganov had asked Council to take note of the court-sanctioned infringement of business operators’ right to post signage in their language of choice and agree not to allow that to happen in his own municipality. Tonight’s non-vote was their response.
Brandt reported that: “South Glengarry is in a unique (?) situation in that we do not have a sign bylaw. And so, our current position is to allow the residents to express themselves in the language of their choice on signage. With regards to the Resolution, Council asked Administration to do an analysis of the Resolution and report back to Council. The results of the analysis are that the motion would be out of order and shouldn’t be put to Council. And that is primarily because 1.) the resolution is worded in the negative and resolutions shouldn’t be worded in the negative; the other is that it’s a re-affirmation of our existing position and re-affirmation motions are also out of order. I know that some people would like to have something like this passed in order to preserve our current position to let people use any language that they choose … There is nothing that Council is able to do to try to preserve our current position or make it more difficult for a future Council to change that. So, this resolution wouldn’t do that even if it was in order. There is also another part of the resolution that makes reference to a particular section of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. We mention in the report that we don’t think that Council should be drawn into endorsing one section of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. If you like, you can pass a resolution endorsing the entire Charter; Administration doesn’t recommend that primarily because you’re bound by the Charter whether you pass a resolution in support of it or not … So, at the end of the day, the resolution is out of order and it’s also not necessary to preserve the residents and businesses current right of being able to advertise in the language of their choice.”
Some would argue that recent history disproves Mr. Brandt’s claim. So far, four Ontario townships are imposing forced bilingualism (English/French) on exterior commercial signs, even if the business operators function in neither of those languages. A court has ruled that the bylaws infringe upon everyone’s right, English, French, Italian, Dutch, and everyone else since all are forced to post (only) in English and French even if they have no English or French clientele. And, a Superior Court judge has ruled that it’s o.k. to over-ride the Charter-guaranteed Freedom of Expression in order to advance a certain cause in Canada.
It also seemed ironic to some in attendance that Council voted in favour of a recommendation to not vote on the resolution after hearing that it’s out of order to vote on a resolution that’s worded in the negative. (Viewers might want to ponder that for a moment.)
It seems that some Francophone businesses and those responsible for public buildings are ignoring the bylaws and not being penalized for doing so, unlike the way that Russell Township treated Howard Galganov and Jean-Serge Brisson when they chose to post signs that were not fully bilingual. The men were fined by the township and ordered by the courts to pay. As we’ve reported previously, in Russell Township, apparently they’ve been meaning to get around to converting unilingual French signs for 30 years now. Also, a community entertainment facility in bilingual Embrun, which also provides day care services, was flaunting a new high tech French-only coming events sign until CFN and Canadians for Language Fairness (CLF) went public with that fact. Beth Trudeau of CLF reports that the centre has switched off the portion of their sign that was promoting upcoming events rather than opting to post bilingual messages. Viewers are reporting other cases of Francophone business operators posting new signs that are not fully bilingual in places like officially bilingual Casselman.
Outside of the Township offices after the Council meeting, Howard Galganov chatted entirely in French with the only identifiable Franco activist, Georgette Sauve, president of L’Association Canadienne-Francaise de l’Ontario (ACFO). They discussed the relatively small number of Francophones at the Council table. Sauve knew exactly who was fluent in French and who wasn’t. She identified herself as being a Francophone resident of the Township.
Sauve told Galganov that: “it’s not a question of language.” Galganov responded that: “If you want to post (a sign) in French only, that is your business; that is your freedom … For me it’s not a question of language; it’s a question of human rights.” Sauve insisted: “Mr. Galganov, we live in a free country. We are free! We are free!” Galganov continued: “Do I now have the right to post a sign in English only in Canada – any place in Canada? The use of the English language in Quebec is illegal! Right now, in at least four Ontario townships, the unrestricted use of the English language is illegal. This is NOT a free country!” It did not appear that Sauve wanted to hear that fact as she summarily dismissed him with: “It’s a question of point of view” as she left the site bidding him a good night.
Galganov took time to speak with us on-camera for the benefit of CFN viewers. He’s not surprised at last night’s non-decision and will be re-doubling his efforts to attain a greater degree of language fairness and respect of inalienable human rights and freedoms.
Chris Cameron, official spokesperson for Language Fairness for All, spoke with us about matters such as the UNESCO’s Guiding Principle of Respect for Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms.
Others in the gallery last night included various members of LFA, CLF’s Beth Trudeau and Kim McConnell, Howard and Anne Galganov as well as South Stormont’s Mayor Bryan McGillis and Deputy Mayor Tammy Hart.
Don Smith reports on a variety of topics, notably good news items as well as social justice issues.
That’s an impressive number of Canadian cities that you know of Peter.
And, no, we don’t really need proof that they exist. Excellent work! You get a passing grade on knowing the names of twenty-three Canadian cities.
And for sure, if most of the commentators on this site agree with you, that is absolute proof that most Canadians from coast to coast agree with yous too.
@ Peter
I can attest ot you have said , Peter.
AS an older, and well travelled canadian businessman , bilingualism is not accepted nor tolerated in Canada.
Just 17% are supposedly bilingual, and thisi s a number that is indeed falling.
YEt to spend 3-4 billion a year, is just plain stupid.
The wealthier provinces will only put up with this for so long.
the proof is that even Dany Williams in NFLD. has ecently spokenout on this forceably.
The tide is staring to turn. It will take while, but it will turn
Ed……you are so funny and witty.
Yep the english are waking up. This country will be so much better. The english freedom fighters are going to fight for our freedoms…….I can’t wait for the tide to turn **smile**
About time the english freedom fighters wake up and fight for the majority. The english will dictate how, why, when and for whom I tax dollars should be spent……isn’t that wonderful?
They will obliterate the french culture and make this nation an english only country…….what more can one ask for in life?? Just writing about it makes me so excited for our future. Thinking I don’t need to back this up with facts….**smile**
Hospitals will be run by the english only. Gov jobs will be available to the unilingual english only because they are the power and backbone of this nation. I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO ENGLISH SUPREMACY!!! Immigrants will have to adhere and adjust to all that is english…..forget about speaking your mother tongue…..CANADA will become an english nation. That is what the english freedom fighters want at all cost…….wonderful isn’t it?
Who cares about the economy, jobs, sickness, the poor, the environment, global warming, wars, killings or disasters….the english freedom fighters are waking up. WHAT A WONDERFUL WORLD AND LIFE THIS WILL BE!!!
stellabystarlight
January 22, 2013 at 6:28 pm
(1)”They will obliterate the french culture and make this nation an english only country…….what more can one ask for in life??”
-So Moderator -are we to allow hate propaganda ?As this statement clearly is hate propaganda.
(2)”The english will dictate how, why, when and for whom I tax dollars should be spent……isn’t that wonderful?”
Why do you continue to divide the populous as English verses French Stella?
This is about Equity not French vs English it about fairness in government hiring .
You Stella ,YOU make it an French vs English issue .
(3)”I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO ENGLISH SUPREMACY!!! Immigrants will have to adhere and adjust to all that is english…..forget about speaking your mother tongue…..CANADA will become an english nation.
But lets see Stella asking for equality is asking for English supremacy?-Actually Stella MOST Immigrants that arrive in Canada already have an understanding of English as for their mother tongue the biggest threat is the manditory french .
When an immigrant becomes a Canadian citizen and attempts to apply for those coveted Government jobs , their native (mother tongue) is not even considered an asset ,but only have access if the are bilingual french.
So in the interest of Forced bilingualism these immigrants will loose their mother tongue which is truly sad,as I am a believer in many languages not just one that has been legislated in.
(4)”About time the english freedom fighters wake up and fight for the majority. The english will dictate how, why, when and for whom I tax dollars should be spent……isn’t that wonderful?”
Now Stella its up to the majority to see where those tax dollars are to go !Its not the English ,but the majority -KEEP your ENGLISH HATING out of this for once !English is a language spoken by many cultures and races ,please do not refer to those other cultures and races” English” may be considered an insult.
But for you that’s alright you do not like other cultures as you have already stated this.
Stella there are 87% of the population speaks English -does not mean they come from English culture-there are many Arab cultures that speak french -because they speak french does that mean french heritage?
-Language is language you choose to make this a French vs English it is NOT ,we have cultural diversity whether you like it or NOT Stella ,this is about equity and fair government hiring policies.
(5)-Who cares about the economy, jobs, sickness, the poor, the environment, global warming, wars, killings or disasters….the english freedom fighters are waking up. WHAT A WONDERFUL WORLD AND LIFE THIS WILL BE!!!
But Stella you have said it many times before “who cares what happens as long as its not in my back yard”
SPIN,SPIN,SPIN -KEEP THE PROPAGANDA MACHINE GOING STELLA .Keep your ENGLISH HATING COMMENTS TO YOURSELF.
@ Stella
He who pays the piper calls the tune
@ Stella
yes stella, the English should control how taxpayer dollars are spent , since they PAY THE MAJORITY OF TAXES
No Stella, unlike the french in quebec, we will not have English signage only. You will be FREE TO PUT UP ANY SIGN,IN ANY LETTERING YOU WISH
pLEASE INDICATE WHERE ANYONE SAID THAT THE FRENCH WOULD BE OBLITERIATED
GovernMENT jobs will again be at the behest of the majority, English, AS IT SHOULD BE. The french can take a test to see if their English is up to par, and they too amy apply for Government jobs.
Immigration will be English, as quebec is french.
Canada is an English nation, no matter how the current and recently past governments try to characterize it, simply bacause the majority here are English.
The french can and will flourish as they always have prior to bill101.
they were never ,ever threatened or abused like the English are in quebec.
Where numbers warrent it, french services will be mandated.
Unlike the current status in quebec, where English is outlawed
The canadian economy will be better off not paying 3-4 billion a year for a bilingualism no one wants, therefore a savings
GOvernment jobs will finally be equitable, and rightly so.
AS for killings, ,global warming, etc. these will be dealt with on demand by the population and their funding passed by a Majority English government.
And stella, that is the way the natural order of things will evolve.
Quote from Peter on another thread…
“If that’s all it takes to get quebec out, I’ll gladly stomp on their flag.”
Now there’s a class act! It’s always good to have calm, rational and respectful debate when discussing the breakup of Canada. Peter should consider a career conflict resolution.
edit… “in conflict…”
@ed
Thanks, typical of you to put your misinformed spin on a thread tht you failed to put in context.
What you didn’t say, was that the separatists were stomping on the Canadian flag, since the 1960’s, and, as recently as the last quebec election they were at it again.
I responded in kind, its simple ed, they step on my flag, I ‘ll step on their’s and rightly so, eddy, baby.
Ed, you or yours, won’t embarass or intimidate me, I am one of those , like Dany Williams, who won’t lie down and take it eddy.
When anyone gives me something, I always give them back a receipt.
@ ED
You using terms like “a calm rational and respectable debate”
is a contradiction, and out and out lie.
To have such a debate you must come armed with facts, and stats, and then some.
From your posts here, it is painfully obvious, that you are incapable of providing neither.
You idea of respect is to insult, mock, hurt people who have lost jobs ( Ken ) inflame and misrepesent all that is dignified regarding the debate process.
Peter. I said “respectful debate” not “respectable debate”.
And there is no debate about whether you would stomp on the Quebec flag if that would bring about the breakup of Canada. That quote is entirely within context. So, are you now saying that you really don’t mean what you said? You freedom-fighters really do need some discipline re comments on the internet.
Ed
January 23, 2013 at 4:11 pm
“If that’s all it takes to get quebec out, I’ll gladly stomp on their flag.”
Now there’s a class act!
Was it not you that suggested burning the Quebec flag to get attention for the freedom fighters?
Ed I am sure there are other disadvantaged people out there you can insult instigate anger from or antagonize for your pleasure.
Highlander asked Moderator today at 8:08 am: “So Moderator -are we to allow hate propaganda? As this statement (stella’s) clearly is hate propaganda.”
No, highlander, only the FRAUD Squad is allowed same BS over and over again. Me, I was allowed only once to mention that the FRAUD SQUAD works for the Canadian Ministry of Truth (Minitrue) that is responsible for propaganda and historical revisionism. Second time…and admin blocked me. Maybe because second time I said “Canadien Ministry of Truth”. You see admin is very sensitive to feelings of Canadiens.
Yes Highlander. And I also suggested a mattress-tossing contest and a bikini contest for the July 4th Ottawa demo. Just throwing out ideas to yous guys. Why the hostility? There might be a rule about flag-stomping and burning on Parliament hill, but maybe yous could do that off site somewhere.
Keep us updated on the demo plans. A Facebook page might be something to consider to get the word out.
@ Highlander
Touche
Ed, your “mattress-tossing contest and a bikini contest” ideas are too sexy. It’s so LIEBERAL that it’s no funny.
I better like the PQ’s noise of pans and pots to send out a loud and clear message.
@ nat
So very true, look what happened to leo, who also called as he saw it. It seems the door here, does not swing both ways.
A little pushback, and we are censored.
I guess this too will not be allowed
I find this interesting. Hey everyone, take note what happens when I take this verbal diarrhea that was spewed in a message on January 22, 2013 at 6:28 pm and simply change the word English to the word French and vise versa accordingly.
Do you notice how, instead of being propaganda and garbage the way it was in it’s original form, it now rings with so much MORE truth and reality as to what THE FRENCH have REALLY done, are REALLY doing and will REALLY do in both their so called “Nation” du Quebec and throughout Canada in general ?
————————
“They will obliterate the – English culture – and make this nation a – French only country – what more can one ask for in life??”
Hospitals will be run by the – French – only. Gov jobs will be available to the unilingual – French only – because they are the power and backbone of this nation.”
Immigrants will have to adhere and adjust to all that is French forget about speaking your mother tongue….. CANADA will become a
– French nation – That is what the – French – want at all cost.
Who cares about the economy, jobs, sickness, the poor, the environment, global warming, wars, killings or disasters.
————————
It’s also interesting to note that you can do this with MOST of the diarrhea that comes from practically all of those of this ilk and end up with the same results.
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peter
January 23, 2013 at 8:01 pm
@ Highlander
Touche
Thanks,
Ed
January 23, 2013 at 7:32 pm
And then he asked why the hostility ?
-Why instigate anger as well as your antagonistic behavior?
edudyorlik
January 24, 2013 at 2:08 am
Yes very interesting ,in fact more the reality isn’t it ?
Neither way is accepting !
But people out there in those statements why is it Stella keeps making it French against English issue? re-read her last statement :
stellabystarlight January 22, 2013 at 6:28 pm
She really works hard at dividing the cultures pitting one against the other,as it works in her and her group of ethnocentric people to divide the cultures in this way.
I have and many within LFA have spoken to francophone’s that do not agree with the hospital and government hiring practices ,and they agree MERIT should always be first not language,and language should be where numbers warrant!
The original intent was numbers warrant to provide french services:
For all you people out there put aside the views either way and think logically -21% francophone’s in Canada yet 65% of the government is deemed bilingual to provide those services ,so why 300% above the Quota?
Does your boss hire 300% more people to do the job?
Does your manager say we need 4 new employee’s then hire 12?
On a shift does your employee have 300% more employee’s then needed?
So what is really going on? There is a good reason 49,000 people cross from Hull/Gatineau every day into Ottawa.
Do Canadians not see how illogical this all is ,or do they choose not WAKE up to reality.
Avoiding dealing with the issue does not mean it goes away ,but it does mean the problem grows.
In response to highlanders POST on January 24, 2013 at 7:30 am
From what I remember, “the original intent” was simply that the Federal government would provide services to our French compatriots in their language within the federal government. PERIOD
And, generally speaking I truly believe most Canadians were completely OK with that. However, that has unfortunately morphed into –
give em an inch and they’ll take a mile – I can hear my late mothers voice speaking to me now —
— the FLSA and the cr@p we see going on today.
The fact is highlander, as much as it might be an unpleasant pill to swallow, we simply MUST ACCEPT that this is not just some concrete building in Quebec somewhere that is causing all of this and forcing this insane problem. It is indeed – PEOPLE — and IT IS NOT English people.
We are stuck in a state of saying, “Quebec”, does this, or “the politicians in Quebec” did that, or “they” are doing this when in fact the bottom line is that it is INDEED a group of influential and powerful
— FRENCH PEOPLE —
You know, I have a great dilemma in all of this because unlike many of the just pure unilingual English /Irish / Scottish type Canadians I am one of a few on this side of this cause that is 50/50 and I truly FEEL that tug on the other side. Because of the exposure I do understand their “head space” if you will. I was around the French side of my family while growing up and I KNOW their mentality and way of thinking. Their “cultural persona” If you will. I also am very aware of the English “cultural persona.” I believe P.E. Trudeau felt this and knew this also (likely even better than me) which I believe is why he had a great feel for what he could get away with regarding the two cultures and this issue. He likely knew that one could be pushed quite far while the other would be more brash and would likely fall right into the take take take mold. This kind of insight does not make one side bad and the other side good. It frankly just accepts WHAT IS THERE. The difference between the two cultures is indeed REAL.
Thus, within that idea we must accept that it is not buildings but people – French people – with French cultural personalities that are involved in this issue. And, I think it is safe to say that despite the fact that it may very well NOT BE the majority that feels this way, I believe that deep down on some level (having that 50% in me that identifies with it) MOST do have that sense of inflated pride that drives them to half heatedly (more like three quarters) to go along with a situation that emboldens and heightens their culture to it’s max, and therefore, as much as we say, “oh, there are many French people who don’t agree” unfortunately the numbers ON THAT side of this issue when including those a fore mentioned ones who sit in silent acceptance, brings that side of things to a much larger percentage than one might think.
Sort of like how the situation was with the FLQ back in the day. Most were likely against what was happening and the violence but at the same there are news clips that tell the REAL story about how MOST Francophones also had an unspoken sense of backseat support within the “yeah, they are right” mantra.
The perfect catch 22 situation.
I believe that IS STILL the case with the French today. In other words MOST actually do believe they MUST do away with English in Quebec and thus there is a silently support what the OQLF is doing, though when asked in public they might say, “well, it’s a bit overboard” so as not to appear too radical.
As much as it is distasteful to accept, IT IS a French culture VS English culture situation at this stage. SAD but TRUE.
–
And no Stella, it is NOT to get rid of the French the way the French are trying to get rid of the English. It is to stake claim to a sense of fairness about what was rightfully ours and what we so graciously practically gave away within the ideal of trying to be fair and nice. But then, I don’t expect someone of your limited character to understand and appreciate that.
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Oh and, in answer to your question Highlander,
Highlander wrote, “So what is really going on? There is a good reason 49,000 people cross from Hull/Gatineau every day into Ottawa. Do Canadians not see how illogical this all is, or do they choose not WAKE up to reality..”
I say yes, they do see how illogical this is but the “Canadians” that DO see this and could possibly do something about it, have themselves just driven across the bridge and settled into their comfy seat at the PM’s office.
The evidence –
Abolishing English in the “province” of Quebec; Passing laws to drive English speaking people out; Treating English people in that province with third class indignity while pushing French for ALL the ROC; Setting up French only health clinics, schools and planting tribal flags that denote French ONLY areas etc etc etc…
— supports the idea that there is a take over in progress and the federal system has pretty much already been taken over from within so there is ONLY ONE WAY out of this.
And that is to somehow wake up the sheer masses of Anglophone people who constitute the majority of tax pay citizens in this country and have them realize that WE MUST decisively act as ONE to show that WE WILL NOT take this laying down.